--- Log opened Thu Jun 01 00:00:00 2023
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01:14 < Intrepid> Hi all, I'm about to buy a printer to work with my OpenBSD 7.3 installation. Can anyone point me to any online resources that I can use to check particular printer models for compatibility with OpenBSD ?
01:15 < Tekk> Where were you earlier? :)
01:15 < Intrepid> Sleeping
01:15 < Tekk> Apparently the secret these days is to look for a printer that says it's "airprint compatible" or something like that
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01:15 < Tekk> Which means "We actually have a working IPP implementation"
01:16 < Intrepid> yeh... I've found this https://openprinting.github.io/   but whatever compatibility it lists by manufacturer seems to only be penguin (linux) related...
01:16 < Tekk> According to some cups forum I looked up that more or less means every printer these days, to the point where the concept of having printer drivers at all in cups is deprecated
01:17 < Tekk> I believe any of those printers marked "IPP Everywhere" would be fine
01:18 < oldlaptop> Intrepid: The relevant machinery is all shared between Linux and OpenBSD (and in fact probably has the most users on macOS)
01:19 < oldlaptop> A relative few of those printers you might even manage to get working with lpd in base; not sure that's worth bothering with
01:19 < Intrepid> Thanks Tekk and oldlaptop  I'm gonna see if a prospective Brother DCP-1200w has this IPP everywhere compatibility..
01:20 < Intrepid> DCP-J1200w.  It's a crappy low end MFC but that's all I need..
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01:27 < martian67> oldlaptop: apple no longer maintains CUPS
01:27 < martian67> they stopped years ago now
01:27 < martian67> as was stated, they just rely on IPP compat
01:27 < oldlaptop> They still *use* it, IIRC
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01:32 < oldlaptop> someone with a dogcow avatar even fixed a couple CVEs in their fork last year, apparently: https://github.com/apple/cups/commits/master
01:33 < oldlaptop> (If "fork" is the right word. "tine"?)
01:33 < thrig> I recall the code being pretty... atoi on whatever's in this here pointer? sure!
01:33 < Tekk> Intrepid: worth noting with that list htat you may need a firmware bump
01:34 < Tekk> For fun I tried setting the IPP Everywhere driver on my printer, which is listed on their site
01:34 < Tekk> Sending it a print jobs causes it to spit out every piece of paper in the tray :)
01:34 < Tekk> a print job*
01:34 < Intrepid> hah, useful
01:34  * oldlaptop generally doesn't treat cups as anything acceptable to use in a context where a CVE would be relevant
01:34 < thrig> nor printers
01:35 < Intrepid> This firmware upgrade could be an issue given I'm running a decade old laptop.... The latest firmware for it is from 2014... It won't therefore work with IPP Everywhere right?
01:35 < thrig> so we send this here software application (PostScript) to a software application execution environment (the printer)
01:36 < oldlaptop> Tekk is (I hope) not talking about firmware for your laptop (which should not be relevant here)
01:36 < Tekk> Yeah, for your printer
01:36 < oldlaptop> thrig: Oh, like a webpage, right?
01:36 < Intrepid> oh right, well it's likely gonna be a new printer so that should be fine then
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01:37 < thrig> blaster or some worm and the HP printers started printing gibberish
01:39 < Intrepid> The challenge for me now is to find a cheap Brother MFC (Printer/scanner) that has Ethernet and USB connectivity... This Brother DCP-J1200W doesn't seem to have USB connectivity
01:40 < Tekk> HA
01:40 < Tekk> My printer works under openbsd now
01:42 < Tekk> Intrepid: So it works but you can't use autoconfig
01:42 < Tekk> It won't like the DNS names, you need to feed in the IPP url manuall
01:42 < Tekk> y
01:42 < Tekk> If your printer is like mine
01:43 < Tekk> and you'll be selecting the "IPP Everywhere" driver
01:43 < Intrepid> and Tekk by "autoconfig" are you referring to my basic DHCP networking
01:44 < ryan> i was happy to discover the brlaser package works great with my printer as well
01:44 < Tekk> I mean the thing where it goes "Oh, I see a printer on your network! It's lpd://BRN57934791324/BINARY_P1"
01:46 < oldlaptop> openbsd's dns stack won't resolve the wacky avahi names
01:46 < Intrepid> I think this useful article makes reference to something lpd related: https://ffuentes.sdf.org/unix/2021/06/10/printing-in-openbsd.html
01:46 < Tekk> Mine did
01:47 < Tekk> I could print blank pages just fine with the weird lpd://avahiname
01:47 < oldlaptop> hm, is *cups* resolving it then?
01:47 < Tekk> Might be?
01:47 < Tekk> I don't think I have avahid running so I'm not sure how that happened
01:48 < Tekk> Yeah, don't even have avahi installed. No clue how it's finding that...
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02:56 < Intrepid>  /quit
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04:11 < jordanreger> hey there! are there any good guides on how to get user directories running with httpd? i know nginx has some ways to do it but i want to stick with httpd. basically i want https://domain.tld/~username. thanks!
04:12 < Tekk> I don't think httpd does them in the "usual" way? I see no reference to user directories in the httpd.conf man pages
04:14 < Tekk> I believe httpd also chroots into /var/www
04:15 < Tekk> (man pages agree with me)
04:17 < jordanreger> yeah i think that's probably going to be the best way to do it
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04:22 < quinq> What way?
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10:17 < olk> I'm about to install OpenBSD on my T480s, thought I should verify: does this https://github.com/openbsd/src/commit/a81f321c894bd27172a28087a81cf6e8aa86d6db commit mean I can read from and write to EC and use native charging thresholds?
10:17 < olk> or is it just a software method to make system think my upper threshold is 100%?
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10:49 < olk> anyone?
10:50 < lavaball> too early.
10:50 < lavaball> come back later. or you are welcome to wait of course.
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10:53 < olk> I see. so no access to EC on OpenBSD yet?
10:53 < lavaball> what?
10:53 < lavaball> no.
10:53 < lavaball> or maybe.
10:54 < lavaball> i don't nkow.
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10:54 < lavaball> the people who are able to help you usually show up later in the day.
10:55 < lavaball> that's usually what "too early" means. 
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10:56 < olk> I see. gotta ask in the evening then. also, no reason to send 6 messages in a row if you can send one
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10:57 < xse> olk: https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-cvs&m=168436150408382
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10:58 < olk> that's exactly what I wanted to see, thanks
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11:00 < olk> I've been waiting for this functionality to apper in OpenBSD for a long time :)
11:00 < olk> *appear
11:03 < xse> looks like it's working here
11:03 < olk> you just tested it?
11:04 < lavaball> do you have a limit on the messages you can read? is this a provider thing?
11:05 < olk> no, it's sanity thing
11:05 < sibiria> it's ok to scale your terminal up beyond 80x24 characters. this is 2023
11:05 < lavaball> if you actually had your terminal that small, i will apologies. anything for the 31337 people.
11:05 < lavaball> apologise
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11:06 < olk> no, dude. it's just wall of text you could avoid posting
11:06 < xse> yeah i get "hw.sensors.acpibat0.raw0=0 (battery idle), OK" while plugged in AC and between the limit, did go down 1%.
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11:07 < xse> tho i assume results may differ between models and so on, P14s gen3 amd here
11:07 < olk> xse: thanks a lot for feedback, I have the same behavior on linux with tlp
11:07 < lavaball> you call one to three words a line a wall? you better hope the huns won't attack you.
11:07 < olk> xse: wow, nice machine. congrats
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11:08 < pardis> in general, expect bugs with things committed to -current last month
11:08 < sibiria> lavaball: also it's an unnecessary waste of the limited aether. at least telcos keep telling me it's limited hence they must bump per-mb charges all the time
11:09 < lavaball> we gotta protect against the huns. 
11:09 < olk> pardis: I understand. it's better to send feedback and experience bugs than not to have the functionality at all though
11:10 < pardis> agreed, just as long as you're aware it may not have been tested on your specific model of ThinkPad yet
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11:10 < olk> then it will be :)
11:11 < olk> alright, gtg. thanks for the marc link xse
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13:32 < fireglow> Is it possible to set a default DNS resolver per rdomain?
13:33 < pardis> not in a nice way
13:33 < pardis> you could have pf rdr-to DNS traffic based on rdomain
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13:37 < renaud_> or you can have a resolver wth a split horizon per rdomain
13:40 < Bradipo> Well, let's be careful on terminology here...
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13:41 < Bradipo> split-horizon is typically a term that refers to "publishing" DNS content, not "resolving".
13:41 < renaud_> indeed, that was more an illustration and it doesn't really change the resolver either
13:42 < Bradipo> e.g. my DNS server publishes one answer to a given record to client A and a different answer to client B.
13:42 < renaud_> yes, it depends on what behaviour is wanted
13:42 < Bradipo> By "resolver" I assume is understood the IP address found in /etc/resolv.conf
13:43 < sibiria> you can achieve most of this, possibly all of it for your purpose, with unbound already
13:44 < Bradipo> Well, I'm still not sure what the goal is.  What is trying to be "achieved"?
13:44 < sibiria> it can tag queries (and act differently on tags) depending on what IP block they come from - but you would have to do the clumsy thing of running different networks in each rdomain
13:45 < renaud_> yes, we need to understand what the final goal is to give a good answer
13:45 < sibiria> it can also tag depending on interface of the request, which gives another vector to approach the problem with
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13:55 < fireglow> sorry, the router hit a kernel panic, I wonder if my previous message got through
13:55 < fireglow> Hmm, my end goal is to have a proxy server accept connections from my LAN, and use a rdomain for outgoing connections
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14:00 < Bradipo> Do you really need rdomain for this?
14:00 < Bradipo> rdomain complicates network configuration and in my opinion should be avoided unless there is no alternative.
14:04 < IcePic> I think I agree with that too
14:05 < phy1729> They're handy for road warrior setups. Set an rtable for your user in login.conf/login.conf.d, make wireguard the only if in that rdomain.
14:08 < IcePic> Its also nice for routers having overlapping networks on different interfaces
14:10 < fireglow> Yes, I will have to move away from rdomain because I keep hitting a kernel panic in wireguard in conjunction with rdomains.
14:10 < fireglow> makes things easier
14:10 < sibiria> you should report that
14:10 < phy1729> You should report that  https://www.openbsd.org/ddb.html
14:10 < sibiria> OK MR COPYCAT, GOSH
14:10 < sibiria> worst case it might be exploitable
14:11 < phy1729> I had already typed it and was looking for the URL :p
14:11 < fireglow> i can't get ddb to run, the USB keyboard becomes unresponsive :(
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14:14 < fireglow> there are (literal) screenshots only https://lunar.firc.de/s/FJofboBf5jqrJk6 
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14:15 < fireglow> do you think a bug report without access to ddb will be useful?
14:16 < phy1729> That link is 403
14:17 < sibiria> a bug report explaining your setup so that it can be reproduced is definitely useful
14:19 < fireglow> phy1729: sorry, should work now
14:19 < fireglow> sibiria: ok I will look into that
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14:21 < phy1729> fireglow: that looks related to the umound command not wireguard/rdomains
14:23 < fireglow> ah well the problem is, when I `ifconfig wg0 down`, the ifconfig command locks up, and any ifconfig that touches wg0 after that locks up as well, so I wrote a script that stops all services and unmounts all partitions, and that's when the panic hits
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14:25 < phy1729> Could ktrace ifconfig wg0 down and see what call is hanging
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14:26 < IcePic> wonder if soclose() and sofree() indicates some kind of socket living on the fs'es that races the umount?
14:26 < IcePic> but it does look fs related from the screenshots 
14:28 < phy1729> I think that's just how fifos are implemented?
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14:31 < IcePic> just wondering if that would be the relation to network interfaces, if there is one
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14:34 < fireglow> hmm, it just happened again, this time the interface wasn'
14:34 < fireglow> hmm, it just happened again, this time the interface wasn't in an rdomain
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14:38 < sibiria> it's strange that your USB keyboard stops working. does it happen to be a virtual machine?
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14:40 < fireglow> sibiria: no, this is a small DELL WYSE thin client (Wyse Z90DE7
14:40 < sibiria> so likely no ps/2 port
14:40 < pardis> it's not strange at all
14:40 < pardis> there is no USB in ddb
14:41 < fireglow> unfortunate, the machine doesn't have PS/2 ports.
14:41 < sibiria> on my pine64, with usb keyboard, i have access to the console when ddb kicks in
14:41 < pardis> you can also analyse a crash(8) dump after a reboot, if you disable swap encryption to allow the dump to be saved (see sysctl(2))
14:42 < pardis> maybe arm64 does things differently? that's surprising to me but USB keyboards definitely are not usable in ddb on amd64 and never have been
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14:47 < fireglow> can I do something right now to analyze why the `ifconfig wg0 destroy` is hanging? phy1729 mentioned ktrace, is that enough?
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14:48 < fireglow> or should I focus on getting the crashdump when I unmount partitions?
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14:51 < fireglow> on second thought, that won't work because it is exactly the /var partition I want to unmount since it had the most fsck errors in the past when I just powered off the system on the ddb prompt.
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15:42 < kodcode> Hello, I get uvn_flush: obj=0xfffffd8129d8a4b0, offset=0x5c0000.  error during pageout in dmesg. Any idea what's going on?
15:45 < kodcode> uid 1000 on /tmp: file system full
15:45 < kodcode> uvn_flush: WARNING: changes to page may be lost!
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15:54 < dayid> yeah, that usually indicates a full filesystem
15:55 < dayid> For instance, when someone has too small a /usr and it fills when kernel relinking the similar error will be seen.
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15:58 < cjones> good morning/afternoon, can anyone comment as to why the default home folder perms are set to 755 (world readable by other users)?
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16:01 < dayid> cjones: insert citation from likely a 1970s paper about initial unix group and user permission design
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16:02 < cjones> dayid: thank you.... so whats the best practice to change this default behaviour
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16:03 < pardis> have you tried changing the mode on /etc/skel?
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16:05 < sibiria> that's how it's done
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16:07 < cjones> makes sense, I can't believe I only just noticed this now
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16:35 < Bradipo> https://clbin.com/NcdEs
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16:36 < Bradipo> Not sure why sndioctl doesn't like the new device...
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16:53 < eea> gonna write a book "How to unix, an introspection on OpenBSD"
16:53 < eea> 2 chapters with content ripped right outta this channel :P
16:54 < eea> <3
16:54 < thrig> rtfm, noob
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16:56 < sibiria> end with, "problem, officer? it's open source. fix it."
16:56 < eea> ^
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17:17 < leah> i had an idea: autopledge. write a program that scans code and finds every system call it ever makes, then whack a great big pledge command in main(). it wouldn't be foolproof and manual editing after the fact would still be required
17:17 < leah> it'd also print the names of each function or macro where given calls are made, to aid in manual tweaking afterwards, for the hacker to decide where to start reducing them
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17:18 < thrig> or you could run the program until it mostly stops blowing up, which does not involve a code scanner
17:18 < leah> i may or may not write it myself - putting it here as idea in case i don't, then another wily person might do it
17:18 < srfsh> leah: it is agaist the design goals of pledge.  pledge tries to make a program take as much as it needs during init, and lock everything else it doesn't down.
17:18 < srfsh> so, it is just not matter of promises of syscalls.
17:19 < leah> i think it might be useful. depending on the source tree one is inspecting
17:20 < srfsh> unveil might be, but pledge isn't quite, from what I can tell from the discussions of people who had a similar idea to yours.
17:20 < phy1729> leah: you'd need to scan libc and other libs first and build a map from liberary calls to necessary pledges
17:20 < IcePic> leah: lots of calls to libraries will in turn sometimes call other syscalls
17:20 < leah> of course, this relies on there being a main
17:20 < leah> libraries are another matter
17:21 < phy1729> and then figure out when you can drop pledges
17:21 < leah> fortunately, openbsd has full source code for everything
17:22 < IcePic> I think this idea would fail for the same reason the "run once and list the calls and produce an apparmor or selinux config" fails
17:22 < thrig> such as x11 tools randomly calling fontconfig
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17:24 < leah> yeah good point, you can't predict how certain libs will act, it will differ for each use by each program
17:25 < leah> it could still just be a thing that literally just scans code and tells you what is called and where, from your code
17:25 < leah> such a tool probably exists or can be adapted already, for what i want. then you have a generated list to work from, to speed up finding where to look in your code
17:26 < leah> my whole thinking here is.... it's not feasible to manually audit every codebase is it?
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17:26 < leah> hence autopledge. scanning tool.
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17:27 < leah> for lots of small codebases (15,000 lines or less) it might work quite nicely. depends how simple or complex a given port is. my interest here is for stuff in ports
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17:28 < leah> the pledge stuff is really great, but i'm aware of stuff like apparmor or capsicum, this is sort of trying to approach that, but in a pledge way
17:29 < IcePic> I still think the obsd way was best. Let them who are accustomed to how the code actually works put the limits at the right places.
17:29 < leah> not at runtime... and the human being looking at the code would still need to add it all
17:30 < IcePic> that is how they managed to pledge 400+ programs really fast, while seccomp had something like 10 programs (while being really well chosen, still just 10) with support for it
17:31 < leah> there would be a hidden benefit to this aswell. if it would catch on, you've got people having fun running the tool and then looking at code
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17:33 < IcePic> not trying to dissuade the effort, just hint at what the probable outcome will be if you suggest such a tool for obsd source code
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17:34 < schillingklaus> i've always boycotted apparmor on linux, so would not want such a thing on any *bsd either
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17:35 < IcePic> schillingklaus: those tools are not inherently bad, but the "autofix my security" stuff just don't cut it 100%, and when you end up in one of those corner cases, you disable the lot and are worse off
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17:35 < leah> shame opendtrace didn't get maintained
17:36 < leah> https://github.com/opendtrace/opendtrace apparently this person was porting dtrace to run under many OS including openbsd
17:36 < leah> i was just thinking about that. does openbsd have something similar for execution tracing?
17:36 < IcePic> yes, dt(4) and btrace
17:36 < leah> ah, excellent
17:37 < IcePic> not same, but similar
17:37 < CosmicDJ> leah: openbsd is getting there... https://blog.lambda.cx/posts/openbsd-dynamic-tracing/
17:37 < leah> i'm reading the dt and btrace manpages
17:38 < leah> yes, i think tracing would partly mitigate the concern raised, about how a lib used may randomly call this or that system function
17:38 < leah> like, in addition to just scanning code, parse some execution trace while the program is running
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17:40 < leah> yep, that page shows an example output of a trace. that is exactly what i need.
17:41 < leah> of course, use a normal debugging program would also do the trick
17:44 < leah> i mean i was given the figure 400+, but openbsd has 10,000+ ports
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17:47 < schillingklaus> the more ports the merrier
17:48 < leah> yeah and if you keep stats of accesses to packages via repos, you could tally up the most commonly downloaded packages
17:48 < leah> for the purpose of such work, if it were done. then that'd be like, a massive bounty list of things to start tracing
17:48 < leah> and a bored hacker can just pick one off the list to work on
17:50 < leah> i think scanning source code would be pointless. scanning trace logs would be more efficient. so i'll look into that. it's now on my todo.
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17:50 < leah> that example trace output from dt, on that blog post, looks extremely parsable
17:51 < leah> literally just run awk and then sort it all and scan a list
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--- Log closed Fri Jun 02 00:00:02 2023