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06:23 < rahl-> pardis: Thanks pardis. I checked /var/log/messages but couldn't see the notes, e.g. relating to what files might need looking at, or commands that should be run. Will check again
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06:23 < rahl-> I got the -Uu from openbsdhandbook; still have a bunch to learn 
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06:47 < rjc> rahl-: proceed with caution whe using any documentation which does not come directly from the openbsd project
06:47 < rjc> it is often out of date and sometimes incorrect
06:48 < rjc> case in point: https://www.openbsdhandbook.com/installation/
06:50 < militantorc> rjc, hi
06:50 < xtile> I've seen a lot of unofficial documentation point newbs to installing -current.  I find that an unfortunate pattern.
06:50 < rjc> it hasn't been updated to 7.3 but, even for 7.1, the file you'd dd to a usb stick would have been .img, not .fs any more - the change in file naming had taken place between 6.7 and 6.8
06:51 < rjc> xtile: can't comment on that as i'm biased - i only use -current ;^)
06:52 < xtile> ;P
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08:54 < rahl-> rjc: well noted. cheers
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09:16 < manu1> hi
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10:55 < rootwyrm> Hello! I have wg0 which is configured as a client. How can I do something like `traceroute -s (IPv4 of wg0) google.com`? Right now it's just timing out. Do I need to add some routes in hostname.wg0? wg0 should not be the default gateway, however.
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11:56 < sibiria> rootwyrm: you need a route for it as well
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11:57 < sibiria> e.g.   route -n add 8.8.8.8 <wg interface ip>
11:58 < sibiria> though i don't think you'll see any of the packets returning correctly for a ping or traceroute
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12:19 < Posterdati> hi
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12:19 < Posterdati> please help, I have a problem with xenodm on 7.3: it starts X but no greeter showed :). No error on log
12:20 < Posterdati> thanks for any help
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12:31 < gachikuku> hello, I'm wondering if anyone here is using OpenBSD on apple silicon. If anyone does, please could you share your experience?
12:32 < Xeroine> gachikuku: what do you wanna know?
12:33 < gachikuku> What works and what does not, I'm currently on Arch linux (Asahi) but want to give OpenBSD a try. 
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12:36 < sibiria> it's going to be a worse experience in every aspect. asahi has full support for every piece of hardware in M1/M2 macs, and openbsd has support for very little of it
12:36 < sibiria> asahi is the bona fide "alternative OS" for apple silicon macs
12:37 < Xeroine> Oh, well I haven't tested everything, I just use it in the tty with w3m, tmux but I did try xorg and it's pretty slow when stuff is scrolling (in xorg), I was using the defaults but it's not like it's unusable. I think keyboard backlight isn't supported either. No idea about audio, there's aplaudio but I don't know if it's supposed to work with apple silicon ones.
12:37 < Xeroine> I like it more than asahi though
12:39 < Xeroine> gachikuku: checking the battery works as well with `apm` :D
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12:40 < Xeroine> oh and touchpad can be used in the tty as well
12:40 < sibiria> once basic accelerated gpu support works via mesa/drm the user experience will be a lot better
12:41 < Xeroine> I bet
12:41 < sibiria> iirc wifi should be stable as well since 7.3
12:42 < Xeroine> I lost connection a few times on wifi but very rarely
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12:50 < Posterdati> hi
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13:10 < bsddjwe> does openbsd support framebuffer console?
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13:14 < Foxy_> bsddjwe: yes, see this blog post of fcambus https://www.cambus.net/modernizing-the-openbsd-console/
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13:24 < gachikuku> sibiria: Apparently OpenBSD support is on par with Asahi's on Apple Silicon M1 macbook (and that's what i have).
13:25 < gachikuku> Xeroine: maybe trying wayland is worth the try I'm not sure never tried OpenBSD before I mainly want it for developing don't care about consuming tbh like audio it's not an issue
13:27 < Xeroine> gachikuku: there's no wayland on OpenBSD AFAIK
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13:27 < Xeroine> but I don't even need a display server, tty with tmux and w3m is good enough for me
13:30 < gachikuku> KJK
13:30 < gachikuku> oops mistyped that one
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13:31 < Xeroine> oh
13:32 < gachikuku> what about the battery life, and does suspend when the lid is closed work?
13:33 < gachikuku> btw thank you guys for the replies, been emailing random people with no luck of response.
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13:36 < Xeroine> battery life when not doing anything intesive while in tty is about the same as macos, maybe a little less, I don't know, haven't measured. Don't know about the lid thing, never tried it brb.
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13:40 < Xeroine> suspend to lid works heh
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13:45 < sibiria> gachikuk1: it's not on-par, even when excluding the software framebuffer problem. but from what i understand it's stable and runs. it's always something
13:47 < sibiria> 7.3 brought a lot of fixes, plenty of momentum, so there's good promise for an even better experience in 7.4
13:49 < bsddjwe> wait there is no unicode support yet?
13:49 < oldlaptop> openbsd supports any locale you like, as long as that's utf8
13:50 < oldlaptop> the framebuffer console doesn't cover any codepoints outside ASCII, IIRC (or if it does coverage is pretty narrow), and not *all* programs are utf8-clean (mg, for example)
13:51 < oldlaptop> the usual answer to "you mean the console doesn't do $thing?!!?!??" is "that's what xterm is for"
13:56 < sibiria> the console has more than ascii support, though i don't know if it's fully unicode capable or locked to something old like latin-1
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15:12 < rootwyrm> sibiria: ok thank you :) 
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17:30 < markmcb> gachikuku, my experience with battery life has not been great on a framework laptop
17:32 < morpho> what is battery life like on openBSD?
17:32 < thrig> terrible, next question
17:32 < markmcb> the OS just seems to use more power overall, like something isn't optimized
17:33 < morpho> well, every kernel with security hardening is going to be more resource intensive
17:33 < markmcb> i've only ran it on a framework and system76 ... both only would last ~3 hours
17:33 < morpho> is there a way to induce programs into C states?
17:33 < markmcb> on linux with the same laptops i'd get ~10 hours
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17:35 < morpho> Linux kernel handles cpu throttling itself
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17:37 < morpho> I'd imagine it also turns usb ports off when not in use, that kind of thing. I turn a lot of stuff off in BIOS and that saves a few watts.
17:38 < markmcb> yeah, i've never dug into much or tried to tune it. my observations are just on the default setups.
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17:42 < morpho> there are options for the drivers to induce powersaving features
17:43 < morpho> In FreeBSD and linux, I don't know about oBSD
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17:45 < sibiria> very little going on besides a lot of ideas on security
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17:50 < morpho> does openBSD have support for 802.11ac ?
17:53 < sibiria> one of the intel drivers has 11ac support
17:53 < sibiria> that's about it so far
17:54 < thrig> iwx, probably
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17:56 < sibiria> iwm iirc. maybe iwx, too, not sure
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18:04 < sibiria> should be noted also that almost all other wifi drivers are stuck on 802.11g, with like one exception that manages 11n
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18:11 < morpho> thats good
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19:06 < Xeroine> My ssh session keeps freezing very often, around every 5-10 minutes for about 30 seconds and then it's fine or sometimes "client_loop: send disconnect: Broken pipe". Can anybody recommend how to debug this issue? The sshd is on a rasberry pi 4b running OpenBSD 7.3? The pi is connected to ethernet while I'm connecting from a mac on wifi but I haven't had issues sshing to the pi while it had
19:06 < Xeroine> raspbian.
19:09 < sibiria> in-band keepalives can help with some of that
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19:10 < sibiria> disable TCPKeepAlive and enable ClientAlive*
19:10 < sibiria> might need to set the interval to something low like 10 sec
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19:11 < thrig> coffeeshops that inject rst packets are harder to deal with
19:11 < Xeroine> alright I'll try that
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19:11 < sibiria> it's how they build the kind of frustration that requires more coffee
19:12 < sibiria> they're in cahoots with the bean growers
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19:12 < thrig> or they didn't want folks lingering, except for someone who ignored the rst on both ends
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19:16 < Lucas6023> Xeroine: I do it the other way around: instead of touching the server config and changing ClientAliveInterval and friends, I have `ServerAliveInterval 60` in my ~/.ssh/config under `Host *`
19:16 < Lucas6023> at the very end
19:19 < Xeroine> oh
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19:26 < D0peX> i dont understand why hping can't bind to an interface. its seems the unix socket access is denied but i don't see why. Running as root obviously.
19:27 < D0peX> [send_ip] sendto: Permission denied
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19:31 < Posterdati> hi
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19:32 < Posterdati> please help, I have a problem with xenodm on 7.3: it starts X, but no greeter to enter username and password!
19:32 < Posterdati> thanks for help
19:32 < Posterdati> (no errors in log)
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19:57 < Posterdati> :(
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20:17 < Posterdati> :(
20:18 < sibiria> tried switching the display?
20:18 < sibiria> ctrl + alt 5
20:18 < sibiria> or 4
20:18 < sibiria> i forget which the default X display is
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20:25 < thrig> 5
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21:26 < anakimluke> hey! I noticed a behavior during the installation of 7.3 that doesn't happen in 7.2 and I'm not sure if it's a bug, or a bug in openbsd; I don't know if I should report it. Attempting to create a VM on virtualbox without changing any settings and installing openbsd, I get either a hang or a panic crash("fatal protection fault in supervisor mode") when installing the default sets. I only found two states I can set the VM to 
21:26 < anakimluke> that make for a successful installation. 1. Changing the chipset to ICH9. or 2. Keep the chipset as PIXX3 and uncheck "Enable I/O APIC".
21:27 < anakimluke> I don't know about the implications of setting those options, only that it's another annoying error the user will have to figure out.
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22:29 < anakimluke> (actually, at least as of solution 2, it only works sometimes. and I couldn't get it working at all using virt-manager)
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22:33 < sibiria> for vbox and openbsd i always used ich9
22:33 < sibiria> and sata/ahci storage, not ide
22:42 < anakimluke> sibiria, huh. I changed it from ide to sata and it did work without the modifications I mentioned.
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--- Log closed Sun Jun 11 00:00:12 2023