--- Log opened Mon Sep 25 00:00:07 2023
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00:43 < coreystephanphd> OpenBSD is so boring. Gosh. Upgrade? sysupgrade. Works every time. Has for months on end. Rolling release in -current? Entirely dependable. Packages? They all just work. So stupid. I am tempted to use a Mac or Arch Linux just so I can stop being bored out of my mind with everything working perfectly for months on end.
00:44 < coreystephanphd> :)
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00:45 < zyxer> Tbf arch has turned stable compared to manjaro
00:46 < zyxer> But yea I have nothing to do anymore on my devices. They just work 
00:46 < pony> I use openbsd btw
00:47 < zyxer> Smart choice if you want nothing to do all day
00:51 < il> pony, are you epony
00:56 < gry> how long is openbsd's kernel lts if i may ask? saw news about linux kernel lts being shortened, but ive never known how it is for here
00:57 < fro> not really an apples to apples thing
00:58 < fro> there's no lts for openbsd
00:58 < fro> and nothing separate for the kernel itself
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01:02 < fro> https://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq5.html#Flavors
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01:07 < pony> il: no
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01:07 < fro> seems like a yes
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01:08 < pony> I am not epony >:(
01:08 < fro> dropped the e like when clark kent puts his glasses on and nobody knows he's superman
01:08 < fro> !
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01:49 < oldlaptop> gry: all parts of each OpenBSD release are supported for about one year (such that the current release and the previous release are supported at any given time)
01:50 < oldlaptop> (and while we're at it, OpenBSD doesn't maintain a stable ABI between releases either. Usually the breaks aren't as severe as the time_t flag day in 5.5, but they happen routinely, both at the kernel level and in userland)
01:52 < oldlaptop> and so it has come to pass that libc's major version number is 97 on the nearest -current box to hand here
01:52 < gry> Okay.
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01:54 < thrig> reasons not to set the root shell to something fancy you compiled yourself and then forgot about
01:55 < oldlaptop> (really probably not a fantastic idea to set the root shell, ever, on any unixoid)
01:56 < oldlaptop> but especially on openbsd where ksh has most of the fancy-pants line editing stuff and the ABI churns
01:56 < thrig> Chesterton's Fence was made for leaping over for some
01:56 < oldlaptop> There was a fence there?
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06:17 < rnkn> is it possible to create a perl environment chrooted for /var/www using local::lib?
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06:32 < avemestr> gry: Also, it has become very easy to upgrade from one OpenBSD to another. sysupgrade Just Works(TM).
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06:39 < echelon> it wasn't easy before?
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06:44 < avemestr> "Start by performing the pre-upgrade steps. Next, boot from the install kernel, bsd.rd: use bootable install media, or place the 6.5 version of bsd.rd in the root of your filesystem and instruct the boot loader to boot this kernel. Once this kernel is booted, choose the (U)pgrade option and follow the prompts. Apply the configuration changes and remove the old files."
06:44 < avemestr> vs. "run sysupgrade".
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06:45 < rnkn> wow when did sysupgrade arrive?
06:45 < avemestr> 6.6ish.
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06:46 < zelest> It wasn't *that* hard before tbh.. Just reboot into a fresh bsd.rd and go through the upgrade process..
06:46 < zelest> I find syspatch way more valueable.
06:46 < zelest> valuable*
06:47 < avemestr> rnkn: So October 2019.
06:47 < rnkn> I'm green, only ever done sysupgrade 
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06:56 < bz> whats the deal with airplane food
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07:13 < bz> how do i install snap packages on openbsd so i can run discord on gnome for wayland
07:13 < avemestr> Trolls will be trolling.
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07:45 < il> lmao
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07:50 < yj2> how do i type in chat
07:51 < armin> zelest: even if it wasn't that hard, being able to update a system safely, remotely, without rebooting - that's very likely what one would prefer.
07:51 < zelest> true
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07:51 < IcePic> armin: without rebooting is kind of a bummer, some devices really need to get reinitialised at times
07:52 < zelest> armin, but logging in, syncing sources, adding patches, recompile for hours then reboot.. was waaay more annoying than "syspatch" :)
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07:52 < armin> IcePic: as long as i can just type "reboot" in an ssh session and know the system will come up again, sure.
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07:52 < armin> zelest: absolutely.
07:57 < armin> coreystephanphd: îf you want something more adventurous, well, sure, my workstation has 2 SSD drives: manjaro unstable (yes, seriously) and OpenBSD. i think i don't have to tell you which of the both i use for what now. ;-)
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07:59 < yj2> hehe rebooting should reboot the system. recalls working at a datacentre with debian machines running debian with all kinds of bad shit (tomcat)
08:00 < yj2> i should proof read
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08:01 < armin> yj2: A stop job is running for: tomcat (3sec / no limit...)
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08:03 < yj2> you're triggering my ptsd
08:04 < yj2> that site was so fucked up, plug a crash cart into any box and watch the errors scrolling. "those are normal errors, don't worry about them"
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08:11 < armin> i actually tried to use XScreenSaver yesterday. it segfaults, it doesn't respect xrdb-style XResources anymore, and some other annoyances i didn't spot 5 years ago.
08:12 < armin> using i3lock/xlock now, at least that works like a normal person would expect.
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10:07 < avemestr> Somebody at the mailing lists also mentioned xscreensaver breakage a few days ago.
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12:45 < neirac> I'm using a usb audio card, it works but when no audio is playing I hear static is there a way to filter that out ? 
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12:47 < avemestr> Does it only happen on OpenBSD?
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13:00 < neirac> avemestr yes, that's right it only happens in OpenBSD. Is this one: Creative Technology, SB X-Fi Surround 5.1
13:01 < neirac> avemestr is like static and a ticking sound, but playing audio works 
13:01 < avemestr> Does it help to mute?
13:01 < avemestr> "sndioctl output.mute=1"
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13:03 < neirac> avemestr output.mute: no such control
13:04 < avemestr> What does "sndioctl" by itself say?
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13:09 < neirac> avemstr https://termbin.com/tsjc , It seems according to a video that the card has a mic entry, muting that fixes the problem. But I don't see where to mute the mic
13:09 < avemestr> Seems perhaps similar to this: https://www.reddit.com/r/openbsd/comments/wdq6l6/why_do_i_have_static_noise_in_my_headphones_on/
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13:14 < neirac> avemestr thanks a lot!, I'll try it
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13:40 < markand> o/
13:41 < markand> I have (almost) everyday a OpenBSD vm stuck with host vmd process at 100% 
13:41 < markand> 26854 _vmd      10    0 1284M  948M onproc/0  fsleep   34.9H 99.12% vmd
13:42 < markand> unfortunately trying to attach to the console leads to nothing, what can I do to try to diagnose the issue? :(
13:42 < markand> the vm itself runs lighttpd and a python cgi script only
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13:46 < sibiria> try changing the host's time counter if it's set to "tsc"
13:46 < sibiria> sysctl kern.timecounter.hardware; sysctl kern.timecounter.choice
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13:46 < sibiria> acpihpetN usually works smoother for both the guest and the host
13:47 < markand> there are kern.timecounter.choice=i8254(0) acpihpet0(1000) tsc(2000) acpitimer0(1000)
13:47 < markand> I try acpihpet then
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19:27 < Minall> Hello OpenBSD Community!
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19:28 < Minall> I am making a lab where, I want to make an incident example from malware, so for this, I was thinking into having an OpenBSD installation on the cloud, my question is, is it possible to use OpenBSD VMs functionality on Cloud installations?, since perhaps these are virtualisations themselves
19:28 < Minall> I plan on having 2 or more VMs where I can test the malware in safety and check all the steps
19:29 < il> using openbsd as the host system or the guest systems
19:29 < thrig> sad times if the malware exploits the cloud system somehow
19:29 < il> I think either should work, if I'm understanding correctly
19:29 < echelon> thrig: lol yeah
19:29 < echelon> make sure your instance has no IAM privileges assigned to it
19:30 < quinq> /10/15
19:30 < il> ah, i think i finally understood
19:31 < il> and i have no answer to that question lol
19:31 < quinq> No, it's not possible to run vmm(4) on virtualized hardware
19:32 < quinq> (though I don't know what you call “Cloud” installation, do you mean something remotely accessible through Internet, or does it has any more signification?)
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19:39 < Minall> I am planing to use it as the host system, guest systems where I would test the malware would be Linux VMs
19:40 < Minall> thrig lol no, it would be an extremely simple one, I don't think so ...
19:40 < Minall> Something remotely accesible, I'm asking since I'm not sure if AWS are virtualised so it wouldn't let me to virtualise again
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19:44 < quinq> open/11
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20:26 < tetra_> IIRC Exoscale allows to run virtualization. from dmesg : vmm0 at mainbus0: VMX/EPT (using slow L1TF mitigation) 
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20:26 < tetra_> The CTO is pyr@
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20:29 < tetra_> it seems they allow nested instances: https://www.exoscale.com/syslog/install-kvm-on-a-virtual-machine-to-get-nested-instances/ 
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20:35 < quinq> The website is too much cloudy
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20:48 < RobbieAB> Some AWS are virtualised, some are not... But bare metal AWS is very very expensive.
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21:22 < Minall> Well, I'll make a try and tell you guys how it goes, farewell!
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21:24 < nature> Hi all, my server at home is on 7.2 and when I do a sysupgrade it downloads the sets, creates the /bsd.upgrade and reboots, but when I connect back to it, it's still on 7.2, how can I force it to upgrade?
21:24 < nature> I don't have physical access to the machine until a few months
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21:41 < MonsoonSecrecy> who should be the owner of the folder?   WARNING: creating /var/www/htdocs/smokeping/cache/rrdtool.png: Permission denied
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21:42 < quinq> Depends
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21:42 < thrig> the owner (or group) probably should have write permissions of some sort, plus traverse rights
21:42 < quinq> Could be anybody, but I suppose that the one trying to write to it should be
21:42 < sibiria> nature: sure it's not something obvious as running out of space on some file system?
21:42 < quinq> Could be from the group too
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21:44 < MonsoonSecrecy> most folder in /var/www belon to root. is that ok or not?
21:44 < quinq> It's ok
21:45 < MonsoonSecrecy> ok but the smokeping folder should be owned by the _smokeping user?
21:46 < quinq> That could help I suppose
21:46 < quinq> Is _smokeping user the one trying to write there?
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21:50 < nature> sibiria: Nope, got plenty of space left
21:51 < nature> Actually I remember last time from 7.1 to 7.2 I had the same issue, but as soon as I hooked my keyboard and screen to look at what was happening, the upgrade proceeded...
21:53 < MonsoonSecrecy> quinq: I was assuming that but not so sure anymore
21:53 < sibiria> nature: you're not running snapshots, right?
21:56 < sibiria> if you do "sysupgrade -n", can you verify before rebooting that things appear normal and ready for upgrade?
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21:56 < quinq> nature, it clearly looks like you need to upgrade your keyboard to 7.3 first, then the rest of your system
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22:02 < fro> what
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23:23 < nature> Sorry was away for a bit, so I just did a sysupgrade -n and got "Will upgrade on next reboot"
23:25 < nature> I just rebooted and it's still on 7.2...
23:27 < sibiria> have you perhaps edited your kernel using config(8)?
23:28 < sibiria> doesn't the upgrade script log anything to /var/log/messages or so?
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23:32 < nature> I did not touch config(8) at all, let me have a look at /var/log/messages
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23:35 < nature> I see this: "sysupgrade: installed new /bsd.upgrade. Old kernel version: OpenBSD 7.2 (GENERIC.MP) #758: Tue Sep 27 11:57:54 MDT 2022  deraadt@amd64.openbsd.org:/usr/src/sys/arch/amd64/compile/GENERIC.MP"
23:36 < nature> the I see the reboot signal I initiated, and then I see "/bsd: OpenBSD 7.2 (GENERIC.MP) #758: Tue Sep 27 11:57:54 MDT 2022"
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--- Log closed Tue Sep 26 00:00:08 2023