--- Log opened Fri Dec 08 00:00:49 2023
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00:09 < ssm_> brocashelm: I don't know anything about windows, but you can boot both windows and openbsd at the same time, you can set up a network file share, with NFS (if windows supports that) or ldap samba watchamacallit
00:14 < aaronm04> NFS is a recipe for sadness, especially between OpenBSD and other OSes
00:14 < brocashelm> ssm_: i don't use windows anymore. just openbsd and linux
00:15 < brocashelm> i really hate NTFS and the like what they use for their fs
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00:15 < brocashelm> i just want better compatibility with ext4
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00:16 < brocashelm> i have to format a usb stick to fat32 to use it on openbsd because of this
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00:26 < deacon426> greetings and salutations fine people of Libera Chat \o
00:30 < tux0r> and me who isn't a fine people.
00:30 < deacon426> person?
00:31 < tux0r> i'm several, i guess
00:31 < tux0r> not fine though
00:31 < Bradipo> legion?
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00:45 < ssm_> deacon426: one thing I can definitely say about myself is that I'm one of the people that exists
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00:48 < jb1277976> Is there a guide to the disk -e interactive I can't find anything
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00:50 < Bradipo> What is "disk -e"?
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00:50 < ssm_> you mean disklabel?
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00:59 < jb1277976> One sec
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01:41 < jb1277976> https://man.openbsd.org/fdisk#e
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01:41 < jb1277976> https://man.openbsd.org/fdisk#COMMAND_MODE
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03:42 < Bradipo> I notice that one my OpenBSD host, the TCP window seems to be smaller than on a Linux host pulling data from the same server.
03:42 < Bradipo> Would this perhaps be a cause of slower downloads from OpenBSD?
03:43 < Bradipo> Also, this is on a LAN, does TCP scaling matter?
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03:51 < Bradipo> From linux, I'm seeing a calculated window windows size that varies bug goes up to as high as 148608 and a scale factor of 256.  On OpenBSD the window size seems to never go above 8207 and a scale factor of -1
03:51 < Bradipo> Is there something to be tuned here?
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03:55 < Bradipo> If I turn off net.inet.tcp.rfc1323 it seems to get a bigger window.
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04:37 < Bradipo> Bigger window didn't help in this case.
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12:34 < deacon426> morning fine and *rough* people
12:34 < deacon426> or less fine
12:34 < deacon426> :)
12:35 < deacon426> and persons
12:35 < sibiria> morning
12:35 < deacon426> how the heck are ya?
12:36 < lenny1337> morning
12:37 < deacon426> hi
12:37  * deacon426 mumbles something about coffee
12:38 < deacon426> death before decaf
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12:41 < lenny1337> coffee good
12:44 < deacon426> particularly strong coffee
12:45 < lenny1337> i drink weak coffee so i don't need cream
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12:49 < deacon426> that's cool, I tried going au naturale with a little sugar but I do love it rich and went back
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13:39 < sonya> the best coffee is the one you fry and ground yourself..
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13:40 < quinq> sonya, and you grow yourself too!
13:40 < sonya> i wish i could..
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13:53 < deacon426> damn.
13:53  * deacon426 wishes for a living garden coffee included
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14:03 < SOLARIS_s> hopefully this snapshot fixes that go issue
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17:04 < jb1277976> What's up peeps!
17:05 < Zyxer> Hey
17:05 < Zyxer> Tired
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17:07 < jb1277976> I get my ram chores tomorrow. Going from 4gb to 16gb gonna be sweet
17:07 < jb1277976> Chips*
17:09 < jb1277976> Anyone use daemonforums.org ?
17:09 < jb1277976> What are your thoughts?
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17:12 < masetrax> jb127796: On occaision. That or the UnitedBSD forums.
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17:16 < jb1277976> Oo another place. /me googles
17:16 < ssm_> the official openbsd forums are at {misc,ports,bugs,tech,...}@openbsd.org :)
17:18 < avemestr> jb1277976: I don't use it in the sense that I have an account there, but it is my impression that answers provided there are solid in general.
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17:19 < jb1277976> Thanks. It's really browser friendly
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19:16 < jb1277976> ssm_ do you mean the mailing list ?
19:16 < ssm_> yes
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19:17 < jb1277976> ssm_ im subscribed to misc and nobody ask anything 0_o probably cause there system just works or i'm doing something wrong
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19:40 < avemestr> jb1277976: You can always check here if there's new'ish mails on the mailing list: https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-misc&r=1&b=202312&w=2
19:41 < jb1277976> avemestr why am i not getting emails ? im guessing people just write them and they show up on the mailing list and you only get emails if you directly reply or something
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19:57 < rIMpossible> Hello. I found a local exploitable bug in OpenBSD 7.4 which leads an ordinary user to full root access.
19:57 < quinq> nice
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19:58 < rIMpossible> I do not want to send it to the bugs mailing list, because it is too easy and maybe it gets further exploited
19:59 < IcePic> send it to deraadt@ then
19:59 < phy1729> openbsd.org/mail.html lists security@
19:59 < rIMpossible> What is a reliable method, to get the developers informed, without making it public
19:59 < IcePic> or security@ as phy1729 said
19:59 < rnelson> https://www.openbsd.org/security.html#reporting
20:00 < IcePic> extra points for a diff for the fix
20:00 < thrig> be sure to ask for a colorized ls while you're there
20:00 < quinq> haha
20:00 < IcePic> in rust
20:00 < quinq> And put a bin/c99
20:00 < rIMpossible> IcePic: I don't know the dependent services behind, so I let the developers decide and further investigate.
20:01 < rIMpossible> It is not in 7.3 exploitable ;)
20:01 < rIMpossible> Fresh installed system
20:02 < quinq> “Only three remote holes in the default install, in a heck of a long time!”
20:02 < rIMpossible> thrig: lol
20:02 < quinq> Well, actually not remote hole.
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20:03 < rIMpossible> No, I tried to remotely exploit, but it does not work, luckily
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20:03 < rIMpossible> ok, will prepare mail with reproducible steps
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20:04 < jb1277976> sheesh fdisk and disklabel are easy to use if you just play with them and learn it :P
20:05 < thrig> shocking
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20:13 < rIMpossible> mail is out
20:16 < meorly> armv7 page mentions cubox-i4 pro, i have an earlier version, same cpu but single core and less storage, anyone knows if this will run?
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20:18 < IcePic> meorly: I guess you will have to test
20:18 < meorly> yeah, I guess I will
20:18 < IcePic> and single core probably doesn't matter, since armv7 isn't mp-enabled IIRC
20:18 < meorly> though i have a pre-release prototype so it might be wonky anyway
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20:29 < jb1277976> Question. why can disklable only create a parition 4.2BSD and fdisk can't ?
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20:32 < rIMpossible> jb1277976: On the platforms that use fdisk, one MBR partition is used to hold all of the OpenBSD filesystems. This partition can be sliced into 16 disklabel partitions, labeled a through p .
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20:36 < jb1277976> rIMpossible do i need to create a parition on another system first so openbsd gives me the i parition gpt/mbr ?
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20:40 < jb1277976> found it
20:40 < jb1277976> diskable -E sd1 then do A it gives me the i
20:43 < jb1277976> fdisk has -A
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20:53 < avemestr> rIMpossible: Can you say which application you've found the hole in?
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21:13 < jb1277976> What's a good program or is a setting to auotmount disk in thunar or nemo so it shows up on the left side ?
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21:18 < rIMpossible> avemestr: No
21:19 < rIMpossible> avemestr: It would be unfair towards the developers, not to give them a certain time to release a patch for it
21:20 < rIMpossible> jb1277976: What do you want to automount? A usb-stick?
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21:23 < rIMpossible> jb1277976: man 8 hotplugd
21:23 < jb1277976> Thanks
21:23 < rIMpossible> jb1277976: :)
21:24 < rIMpossible> There is a sample attach file
21:24 < rIMpossible> s/file/script
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21:26 < jb1277976> i'm loving openbsd more and more everyday lots to read
21:28 < rIMpossible> jb1277976: read all manpages for the corresponding scripts in /etc/rc.d/ and you should know over time all services
21:28 < jb1277976> ok
21:29 < rIMpossible> The manpages are one of the best documented in unixish systems
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21:37 < rIMpossible> I am looking for a lightweight and slim alternative to xstatbar. Too colourish for my eyes ;)
21:39 < ssm_> rIMpossible: lemonbar
21:39 < jb1277976> being on openbsd is making me feel more unixey then linux ever did :P
21:40 < jb1277976> macos and linux are crutches
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21:41 < rIMpossible> ssm_: thx ;)
21:42 < ssm_> rIMpossible: example https://0x0.st/H3Bv.png
21:43 < jb1277976> beautiful desktop ssm_
21:43 < jb1277976> windows will never be beautiful
21:43 < ssm_> jb1277976: linux is a friend in a hostile world. They eat all the garbage so openbsd can be good
21:43 < jb1277976> lol
21:45 < rIMpossible> ssm_: Very customizable lemonbar
21:45 < ssm_> yeah, lemonbar is awesome
21:45 < ssm_> in terms of things that are very unixy, lemonbar is very unixy
21:47 < rIMpossible> ssm_: xstatbar is not very customizable and the developer refuses to add at least changing the colours and even tells this in the manpage
21:47 < thrig> wear the brown goggles
21:47 < ssm_> jb1277976: I read some about what BSD was like before the AT&T lawsuit, and it apparently suffered from a lot of the same problems with fragmentation that linux did today. I think it's just sort of a consequence of "open source thing gets popular = fragmentation and bad standards"; maybe I'm wrong though
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21:48 < thrig> unix was very fragmented beyond BSD (sun, solaris, HP/UX, digital etc) hence POSIX to try to ...
21:48 < jb1277976> hmm
21:49 < rIMpossible> thrig: yeah, the only thing in common was VUE and CDE
21:49 < rIMpossible> I liked CDE a lot
21:50 < genevino> I still love the look of CDE.
21:52 < genevino> Also AfterStep, WindowMaker, FVWM 2, Fluxbox, PekWM, E15/E16, and I'm sure I forgot many many other oldschool WMs I loved at some point.
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22:05 < brocashelm> yeah, the fragmentation/linuxisms have already been making their way onto the *BSDs...
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22:06 < brocashelm> wayland, pulseaudio, pipewire, jack, polkit, d-bus, etc.
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22:07 < brocashelm> i was running debian 6 on a live boot the other day, and it was a lot leaner then than it is now, with less "convenient" options
22:08 < brocashelm> the kernel couldn't even get temps for my radeon gpu
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22:09 < Reinhilde> we live in a strange world
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22:11 < brocashelm> i do admit it was a red flag with the "wayland experimentation" from xenocara
22:11 < brocashelm> i hope it's only used as a build dependency because of gnome/kde and not to replace x11 entirely
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22:15 < ssm_> brocashelm: In the shower I thought about a license that allows for reading, personal modification, patch submission, but no distribution. That might be a solution to fragmentation once a source-available project grows to a mass scale, but it's not going to make "freedom" idealists very happy
22:16 < ssm_> also it still gives you very little control if something third party becomes standard
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22:18 < ssm_> but it makes sure anything immediately in your projects domain doesn't get copied into something worse that then becomes standard
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22:28 < ssm_> there's nothing stopping John Inc. from forking openbsd and turning it into some much inferior corporatized product like canonical google and apple did to other projects and then using their capital to gain popularity pushing the original project and all its developers into obscurity
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22:46 < uwharrie> good thing they can't prevent us from continuing to use the version we prefer
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23:07 < brocashelm> i'm a bit conflicted on permissive licenses: while the "true freedom" aspect is nice, corporations are greedy/evil and will just take code and use it to violate their users' freedoms
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23:09 < brocashelm> looking at the donations to the openbsd foundation, google and microsoft basically "contributed" scraps of what they are making off code that's not even theirs originally
23:09 < ssm_> Got to ask if distribution of modified code is a fundamentally good idea; what are the benefits? it seems to cause a lot more problems than it solves
23:11 < ssm_> I guess a big one is fixing platform-specific bugs
23:11 < ssm_> which is very real if you've written a port before
23:13 < brocashelm> i think a lot worse was done to freebsd
23:14 < brocashelm> so many proprietary and spyware "inventions" using their code
23:14 < brocashelm> apple, sony, and netflix easily come to mind
23:14 < uwharrie> someone should ban freebsd developers from releasing their code
23:14 < brocashelm> apple only gave $5 to them
23:14 < brocashelm> LOL
23:14 < ssm_> `$ find /usr/ports -type d -name patches | wc -l` == 3851
23:14 < ssm_> it's a lot
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23:17 < brocashelm> at least with openbsd there is more of a conscious effort on improving code and maintaining sane defaults for security
23:17 < ssm_> maybe if you allowed distribution of modified source, but not binaries? would be very painful for John Inc. to tell everyone to compile their software to use it
23:17 < brocashelm> probably would be a pain having to relicense to a modified version of the license of something
23:17 < brocashelm> *or something
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23:20 < ssm_> relicensing is illegal without modifying 40%(?) or more of the code, so it doesn't really matter
23:20 < ssm_> I don't know if that could be exploited by just padding garbage to the source file or not
23:21 < ssm_> reminds me of that time rms went on the openbsd mailing lists and thought you relicense permissively licensed code
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23:24 < ssm_> s/you/you could/
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23:40 < vortexx> https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-misc&m=170206100405026&w=2 <--- lol someone asked about color output for ls in base just tonight
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23:44 < carson> I just saw that, and then laughed out loud at Theo's response that "black and white are also colors"
23:44 < carson> My wife did not find it as funny when she asked what I was laughing at
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--- Log closed Sat Dec 09 00:00:50 2023