--- Log opened Thu Aug 08 00:00:54 2024
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00:03 < brynet> systemdsucks: It's the m1n1 second stage + uboot for apple silicon m1/m2 machines.
00:05 < brynet> https://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/ports/sysutils/firmware/apple-boot/
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00:10 < systemdsucks> brynet: thanks, i'm running 7.5 on an old mac but it's intel so not for me
00:10 < brynet> heh, nope.
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00:15 < phy1729> ssm_: aiui pax is the classic case of two competing standards (tar and cpio) and creating a third new standard so everyone is unhappy.
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00:25 < ssm_> phy1729: well, our pax tar and cpio implementations all support the same archive formats, so I guess we can just use whatever we want
00:30 < phy1729> That's because they're all the same binary. (Also wonder why pax is listed twice in LINKS)
00:34 < ssm_> smart
00:35 < ssm_> works like less or more and changes behavior based on the basename, I'm guessing?
00:35 < oldlaptop> (everyone's actually happy because the only one anyone uses is tar)
00:36 < oldlaptop> for interchange, anyway, at the very least
00:37 < oldlaptop> usually posix is reasonably good-ish about codifying existing practice instead of "let's make up a new standard out of thin air" :(
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00:43 < phy1729> see options.c; it looks at __progname
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04:32 < liturgist> Good evening
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04:32 < liturgist> Has anyone had any experience with the new LDOMs implementation on Sparc T series servers?
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04:34 < liturgist> I used to have a pair of T1000s with ldoms which were a pain to admin, but I’d like to get a used SPARC T series server that would be compatible with OpenBSD’s LDOMS implementation, preferrably a T5120 or newer; does anyone know of any specific models that work well with the OpenBSD ldom server?
04:35 < liturgist> Preferrably one that doesn’t require a netboot install like the T1000, but that would allow for install via ilom or something like that
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05:27 < al1r4d> "SSL failed: error:1400442E:SSL routines:CONNECT_CR_SRVR_HELLO:tlsv1 alert protocol version" i got this on NeoMutt 20240201.. how to fix?
05:28 < jrmu9> does neomutt support SASL?
05:28 < jrmu9> the dovecot config we're using requires SASL
05:29 < thrig> there's a SASL flavor, did you install that?
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05:30 < al1r4d> eh, let me try, thank you jrmu9 thrig
05:30 < al1r4d> "neomutt-20240201-sasl" is this one?
05:31 < al1r4d> but i already had "neomutt-20240201-gpgme-sasl"
05:45 < al1r4d>  okay works
05:45 < al1r4d> i missed something
05:46 < al1r4d> imaps, i should imap
05:47 < quinq> Yeah, can't have too many imaps, better stick to one
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06:10 < runxiyu> Aug 08 06:06:45 runxiyu postfix/smtp[488264]: 0EB1126F3E7: to=<tech@openbsd.org>, relay=mail.openbsd.org[199.185.178.25]:25, delay=12, delays=0.84/0.02/11/0.11, dsn=4.0.0, status=deferred (host mail.openbsd.org[199.185.178.25] said: 451 Temporary failure, please try again later. (in reply to DATA command))
06:10 < runxiyu> mailing lists seem broken
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06:11 < quinq> Or to be greylisted
06:11 < quinq> s/ed/ing/
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06:16 < runxiyu> welp
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09:03 < rnkn> what's the safest way to make a SSL key/cert readable by a user other than root?
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09:04 < sibiria> a shared group works
09:04 < rnkn> or am I better to just run the process (soju irc bouncer) as root?
09:05 < sibiria> also, you're not forced to keep keys and certs in /etc/ssl/private
09:07 < thyssentishman> rnkn: I always chown it for _soju on renewal
09:07 < thyssentishman> don't know of that a good practice but it was the best I could come up with
09:07 < thyssentishman> s/of/if
09:08 < rnkn> thanks guy
09:08 < rnkn> guys
09:08 < thyssentishman> ... in a cronjob of course
09:08 < thyssentishman> not manually
09:09 < rnkn> thing is my cert is a wildcard for my whole domain, I feel a bit reluctant to make the key readable to users other than root
09:10 < rnkn> am I worried over nothing?
09:10 < sibiria> i'd worry about making it world-readable, but that's not what you're doing
09:11 < sibiria> if the software is incapable of dropping its permissions after init, i'd keep a shared group dedicated for access to shared host keys
09:12 < sibiria> as an alternative, you could let the bouncer have its own hostname and cert/key
09:14 < rnkn> sibiria: I was thinking about that, would this just be a case of using acme-client in the usual way, or would that remove the group read permissions every time?
09:15 < rnkn> oh I just got a suggestion in another channel to run soju behind a reverse proxy, i.e. relayd
09:16 < sibiria> i'm honestly not sure what acme-client does when creating the new cert, i don't use it myself. but it doesn't sound like a big thing to just script
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09:34 < sibiria> on the system where i used shared pki i simply keep a "sharedssl" group for /etc/ssl/private, and tuck service users in there
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09:39 < rnkn> sibiria: what else do you run that needs to read ssl?
09:39 < rnkn> I only ask before I go setting up relayd
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09:40 < sibiria> on that host it's a web server, mail server and prosody
09:41 < sibiria> prosody is an xmpp/jabber daemon
09:41 < sibiria> also an asterisk (SIP) trunk on there offering SIPS connectivity
09:41 < sibiria> so for the sake of simplicity and pinning etc. they all use the same pki
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10:39 < rnkn> can the certificate for relayd's keypair be a fullchain certificate? I'm getting an eof error...
10:39 < rnkn> tls keypair
10:43 < sibiria> not sure but i guess it's fine. keep in mind that you shouldn't keep the PAIR in there, only the private key, and the order of a merged chain/pem matters
10:44 < sibiria> first the client cert, then the ca, and last the privkey
10:50 < rnkn> sibiria: yep, private key is still in private/
10:50 < rnkn> I keep getting an eof error when testing my relayd conf with openssl s_client
10:50 < sibiria> what i meant is that the server side of things don't care for the public key
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10:51 < sibiria> the server/service only wants the chain and the private key
10:51 < sibiria> i.e. you shouldn't deal with the keys in a "pair" sense
10:55 < rnkn> is there something wrong with my relayd.conf? https://rnkn.xyz/pb/08af
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11:04 < rnkn> okay made some changes, now I'm getting the new error "packet length too long"
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11:42 < byteskeptical> rnkn: sounds like a protocol mismatch
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11:44 < byteskeptical> are you trying to use an encrypted connection on a non-encrypted port/service
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11:59 < rnkn> byteskeptical: that may be the case, I'm trying to use relayd to perform ssl termination on port 6697 and run irc bouncer soju behind it on 4697
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12:02 < rnkn> soju is non-encrypted
12:02 < byteskeptical> rnkn: you need to add tls to the end of `listen on egress port 6697`
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12:03 < rnkn> byteskeptical: relayd(failed)
12:04 < byteskeptical> right but your trying to reverse proxy a tls connection correct?
12:04 < byteskeptical> also need protocol "https" below that line
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12:05 < byteskeptical> 4697 should be unencrypted
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12:07 < rnkn> byteskeptical: yep, that's what I'm trying to do
12:09 < rnkn> byteskeptical: working! thanks!
12:09 < byteskeptical> no worries bud enjoy
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18:22 < mccd> Heya, I'm trying to figure out what filesystem to use for a 1tb external USB that I want to use for backups. I'd like to be able to mount it on mac, linux and openbsd. What filesystem is recommended?
18:25 < sibiria> the only choice you have is ext2, and for windows you'll need third-party software to get into that unless you employ WSL
18:26 < sibiria> exFAT via fuse doesn't seem to happen for openbsd just yet
18:26 < Bradipo> exFAT on OpenBSD exists... it's dismal, it works, but it's there.
18:27 < Bradipo> There's a package that can be installed to use it.
18:27 < Bradipo> I would prefer a native mount over fuse, but it works.
18:27 < sibiria> seems like it was just a few weeks ago someone was last in here saying exfat-fuse was a no-go
18:27 < Bradipo> Well, maybe a no-go for whatever they were trying to do.
18:28 < Bradipo> I know that it works because I use it.
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18:29 < Bradipo> I like to be able to use disklabel to assign disk  uuids to filesystems so they can be controlled in /etc/fstab by uuid.  As far as I am aware, this cannot be done with exFAT and fuse.
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18:30 < mccd> well maybe ext2 would be a simpler choice since it's supported OOB on OpenBSD
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18:32 < Bradipo> Yes, I would recommend ext2 over exFAT any day.
18:32 < mccd> ext2 it is then, thanks sibiria and Bradipo for the help :)
18:32 < Bradipo> Though, can FFS be mounted on other OSes?
18:34 < mccd> seems to be possible to mount on linux
18:34 < sibiria> depends on what linux. usually you can have a look at /proc/filesystems
18:36 < mccd> on os x I can't find anything for mounting ffs
18:38 < thrig> I used fat-something when moving files between Mac OS X and OpenBSD, just put a tarball onto the device
18:39 < Bradipo> You could use a veracrypt volume. :-)
18:39 < Bradipo> Well, I suppose that doesn't solve the filesystem challenge though.
18:40 < sibiria> mccd: no native support for it. macfuse might be able to, but it does ext2 and you'll need it for that either way
18:40 < mccd> sibiria yeah I looked at the supported file systems for macfuse and only found ext2
18:40 < sibiria> fat32 works everywhere and can do over 1tb drives, but it comes with other challenges
18:41 < sibiria> i wouldn't recommend it for a backup drive unless easy access on all OSes was an absolute must
18:42 < echelon> because of no journaling?
18:42 < echelon> oh, that's ext2
18:43 < sibiria> no, because it's generally iffy
18:43 < mccd> yeah I'm using fat32 right now for the drive and it's not working out haha
18:43 < Bradipo> Can sqlite3 write directly to a partition/disk ? :-)
18:43 < echelon> heh
18:44 < Bradipo> tar can...
18:45 < Bradipo> tar exists on Mac, Windows, Linux, and OpenBSD.
18:45 < Bradipo> But tar on Windows is really outdated.
18:45 < Bradipo> At least the one that I found.
18:45 < echelon> mccd: maybe you can passthru usb in vmm and use a non-openbsd supported fs
18:46 < echelon> wait, can you passthru usb in vmm yet?
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18:51 < sibiria> nope
18:54 < vortexx> mccd: MacOS used to have UFS support, but I don't know what they've done with it of late
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18:54 < vortexx> you used to be able to install (I don't know if it booted) onto UFS
18:54 -!- Vaelatern [~Vaelatern@voidlinux/maintainer/Vaelatern] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
18:54 < vortexx> this was 10.4 era
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18:56 < vortexx> ok, Lion dropped UFS completely
18:57 < vortexx> and Leopard dropped support for installing
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19:32 < ssm_> macos keeps getting better and better huh
19:32 < ssm_> ftp is gone now ufs support too
19:33 < ssm_> and zsh default, but they were using bash before so *shrugs*
19:37 < thrig> a hilariously out of date bash that at one point was unpatchable and had shellshock
19:37 < ssm_> wowzers
19:40 < fro> that is not accurate
19:41 < fro> they released an update for it like a week later
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19:43 < sibiria> to its defense, you can set any shell you want for your tty, and both plain ftp and ufs are kind of obsolete things
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19:44 < fro> they were also removed like 10 years ago
19:44 < sibiria> but it's macOS, not *BSD. it can't be expected to be the same any more than linux can be expected to be similar to the BSDs
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19:46 < sibiria> there are better "gripes" to complain about when it comes to macOS imo :)
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19:54 < ssm_> lack of a good package manager is a start
19:55 < ssm_> homebrews is... homebrew, macports doesn't use system libraries
19:55 < ssm_> s/(brew)s/\1/
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19:55 < fro> well there are no official packages for it
19:55 < fro> so there's that
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19:56 < sibiria> hard to fault macOS for that. i'm sure pacman, apt, yum etc. can be ported there. surely even pkg*, being perl-based
19:57 < ssm_> How do I get my parents off of macos and onto bsd. Is such a task even possible?
19:57 < ssm_> Do I install gnome and hope they don't notice?
19:57 < uwharrie> are they looking to switch?
19:58 < ssm_> definitely not
19:58 < fro> why are you trying to force them to use something else?
19:58 < ssm_> I'm not I'm just shitposting, though I think it would be funny to prank them with openbsd running fullscreen in qemu
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20:01 < ssm_> though maybe I would set up gnome with a graphical package manager (if possible), to warm them up to the idea ;)
20:02 < Bradipo> You could certainly recommend it, but first you need to understand their "requirements".
20:03 < ssm_> they basically just use their computer as a web browser, so very easy
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20:05 < Bradipo> Well, not so easy... do they use Skype, Zoom, whatever with family?
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20:06 < Bradipo> Matrix works well on OpenBSD via element.io for video calls.
20:06 < Bradipo> Do they use a camera with their PC?
20:06 < Bradipo> I'm not saying it cannot be done, but it's a very different world.
20:08 < Bradipo> For all the crappiness that exists in MacOS and Windows, their "market" is clearly unsophisticated users.
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20:11 < setient> i mean you could, setup openbsd with auto patching and automatically start firefox when you login. 
20:12 < setient> Leave a thumb drive that automatically resets everything there with a custom openbsd install.
20:12 < Bradipo> Login and using firefox is hardly a challenge for unsophisticated users.
20:12 < setient> Bradipo: you would be shocked how hard it can be with a slightly different ui
20:13 < setient> i know a non trivial amount of programmers even who can't figure out how to navigate windows coming from macos 
20:13 < setient> or understanding things like discord
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20:50 < kupi> hi, how can I benchmark hdd on openbsd?
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20:57 < uwharrie> Looked at the tools in https://cvsweb.openbsd.org/ports/benchmarks/ ?
21:02 < kupi> thanks, what does K mean in bonnie++ output?
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21:06 < sibiria> often you can get a good indicatino by just using dd
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21:10 < kupi> nvm, found out K is Kilobyte
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21:37 < Bradipo> Can relayd(8) be used to provide an HTTPS tunnelling proxy?
21:38 < Bradipo> Hmm, I do see CONNECT in relayd.conf(5) under methods.
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21:46 < Bradipo> So, if I wanted to host an HTTP proxy using relayd, would that be consider "REDIRECTIONS" or "RELAYS" or "TLS RELAYS"?
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21:49 < kupi> when connecting to a wifi network is it enough to do ifconfig interface nwid network wpakey password, then dhclient ip2w? I get can't ssign requested address when pinging. I don't think it's a missing firmware issue because scan shows networks
21:50 < uwharrie> that could work, although that procedure is a bit dated
21:50 < kupi> what is the up to date one?
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21:52 < uwharrie> `ifconfig...join` works better if you need to choose between multiple networks, and `ifconfig...autoconf` will ensure dhcpleased handles things as dhclient is gone/deprecated
21:54 < kupi> done those but I still have no internet
21:57 < uwharrie> ifconfig has a debug mode to see if you're failing association and dhcpleased has a verbosity option to see if you are or aren't getting a reply to a DHCP lease request
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22:00 < kupi> I have added debug to the left of join and autoconf but got no message
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23:00 -!- at_work [~at_work@user/at-work/x-5282331] has quit [Quit: not at_work]
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23:09 -!- Red [~Red@239.51-174-66.customer.lyse.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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23:17 -!- ficonni [~ficonni@213.196.101.14] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:17 -!- Red [~Red@239.51-174-66.customer.lyse.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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23:28 -!- CrashOverride [~strcat@p5485502c.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
23:35 -!- Red [~Red@239.51-174-66.customer.lyse.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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23:40 -!- Red [~Red@239.51-174-66.customer.lyse.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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23:56 -!- Red [~Red@239.51-174-66.customer.lyse.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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--- Log closed Fri Aug 09 00:00:11 2024