--- Log opened Fri Oct 04 00:00:13 2024
--- Day changed Fri Oct 04 2024
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00:09 < dfdx> Hi #openbsd. Is it possible to create a user that can *only* use scp and/or sftp, but not login with ssh?
00:10 < dfdx> I tried creating a normal user with nologin, but scp gives me an error saying "Received message too long\ Ensure the remote shell produces no output for non-interactive sessions."
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05:04 < mordac> no
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06:14 < oen> dfdx: yes, https://undeadly.org/cgi?action=article&sid=20080220110039
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06:42 < pardis> that only achieves sftp, not scp
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06:43 < pardis> you can probably make it work with a modified ForceCommand, possibly set to your own wrapper script to detect if the user requested sftp or scp (and returning an error if they tried to do something else)
06:43 < pardis> but I don't know offhand how scp "looks" to the receiving command
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06:57 < IcePic> seems smarter to stick to sftp, since that internal-sftp is a good setup security-wise
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07:15 < echelon> don't they have any sftp daemons that work independent of ssh?
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07:21 < pardis> who is "they" and how would that work?
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14:48 < dfdx> Hi #openbsd. I'm having a hard time understanding the difference between OpenBSD's ftpd and ssh's "ForceCommand internal-sftp". Is ftpd unencrypted? I don't think so, but then does that mean its equivalent to an "sftpd"?
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14:48 < dfdx> when I enable "ForceCommand internal-sftp" in /etc/ssh/sshd_config, I can sftp, but not ftp. When I run "# rcctl start ftpd", I can ftp, but not sftp.
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14:49 < dfdx> I'm a little confused as to which to prefer. ftpd seems a cleaner way to do setup (s?)ftp... but i'm not entirely sure.
14:50 < __gilles> dfdx: ftp is unencrypted, it's a fairly legacy protocol
14:50 < __gilles> sftp is an unrelated protocol
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14:51 < dfdx> I see, okay in that case I understand. I will go with sftp. thanks.
14:51 < sibiria> dfdx: ftpd is basic ftp
14:51 < sibiria> avoid it
14:52 < dfdx> ok, thank you.
14:52 < sibiria> not just because it's unencrypted, but also because it's clumsy due to its passive/active/dataport nonsense
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14:55 < dfdx> I never even got that far! good to know.
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14:55 < dfdx> I've got scp/sftp working nicely. users can send/download files, but can't ssh in.
14:55 < dfdx> and they're chrooted.
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14:58 < sibiria> yes it's quite a simple and efficient setup with sshd
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14:59 < sibiria> match users on group or other sensible criteria, then PermitTTY no; ChrootDirectory %h; ForceCommand internal-sftp
14:59 < sibiria> don't forget to set their shell to /sbin/nologin
15:02 < dfdx> sibiria: actually, setting their shell to /sbin/nologin doesn't work.
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15:02 < sibiria> it does, and you should
15:02 < dfdx> sibiria: this is very weird then. on my machine, it does not work. 
15:03 < sibiria> it may be that your directory tree for those "sftp-only" users is incorrect
15:03 < dfdx> i have tested this all day. let me pastebin it here. it doesn't work. let me know where i'm wrong.
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15:04 < dfdx> omg... you were right. I think my chroot directory was wrong.
15:04 < dfdx> yes, nologin works. 
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15:05 < sibiria> the home directory for a setup like this needs to "mimic" /home
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15:05 < sibiria> that is, a root:wheel-owned directory, and within that the actual user home with their own perms
15:05 < dfdx> I have the following
15:06 < dfdx> ChrootDirectory /home
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15:06 < dfdx> ForceCommand internal-sftp -d /ftpuser1
15:06 < dfdx> that seems to work, but it feels a little clunky. 
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15:07 < dfdx> outside of the chroot, the users's home directory is /home/ftpuser1
15:07 < sibiria> what i do is to ChrootDirectory %h (the user's home dir), and i make that home dir root:wheel-owned with 750 perms. inside, i make one more directory which is owned by the actual user
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15:08 < sibiria> when they login, by default, they see a directory with their own name and optionally .ssh if they want to use pubkeys
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15:08 < dfdx> yeah, that was actually going to be my very next question. one of the users (btw this is just family, so my cousin lol) has their own public key. 
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15:08 < dfdx> can I just plot that into /home/ftpuser1/.ssh/authorized_keys ?
15:09 < dfdx> and then they can login without a password? also, how do I create ftpuser1 in the first place? just leave the password empty?
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15:09 < dfdx> :s/plot/plop/
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15:10 < sibiria> dfdx: yes
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15:14 < dfdx> you've been a real help, thanks sibiria.
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15:23 < sibiria> dfdx: you're welcome. this is my setup, for reference: https://dpaste.org/FktbK/raw
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15:27 < dfdx> that is extremely helpful, thanks.
15:28 < dfdx> one thing I am learning is that users that can sftp in can browser other users' home directories. Are there any footguns I should be aware about before I chmod -R 700 everyones' home directories? 
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15:29 < dfdx> well, i guess it'll set the execute bit on all files, which doesn't make any sense. ugh.
15:29 < sibiria> with the particular setup i showed, sshd wants to home dir to be group-readable in order to check the authorized keys
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15:29 < sibiria> which is why it's "r-x" in my setup
15:29 < dfdx> ahhh...
15:30 < dfdx> and i guess they can never leave /home/bleep to navigate to /home/bleep2, either.
15:30 < sibiria> other than that, the only thing you may need to think about is the typical case of a shared web server setup with "userdir" feature enable
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15:30 < sibiria> correct
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15:31 < sibiria> if someone would find an exploit to break out of there, with the shared group membership as used in my example, there are bigger problems than them seeing the user names :)
15:33 < sibiria> i used a shared group for this only out of convenience. you can run the same setup with users having their own group and just adjust the Match directive in sshd_config accordingly
15:33 < sibiria> i personally don't worry about using a shared group dedicated just to this
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15:42 < zwr> looks like OpenBSD 7.6 is coming out soon, the 7.6 package repository is being built https://cdn.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/7.6/packages/
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15:49 < lts> \o/
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16:04 < Foxy_> zwr: OpenBSD 7.6 release planned October 21 2024
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16:05 < Foxy_> zwr: correction, 7.6 release now planned October 8 :) see https://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/src/etc/root/root.mail?rev=1.174&content-type=text/x-cvsweb-markup
16:06 < eea> October 8?!
16:06 < eea> i literally just upgarded last 7.4 host
16:07 < lts> Now you have it all in fresh memory
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16:07 < eea> excellent work openbsd team, no snark
16:07 < Foxy_> eea: yep, Theo has modified release date from October 21 to the next week (Tuesday 8)
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16:08 < eea> i tried, and failed, to fully grok the full changelog
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16:08 < eea> but, looked good to me
16:08 < eea> yesterday
16:08 < lts> I can finally update one box which needed a snapshot to run all pkgs broken during 7.5 changes (go..)
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16:09 < eea> that 7.5 reminded me that i should probably get away from php7
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16:16 < dfdx> upgrading php is so scary.
16:18 < eea> true, but less scary to me than a major version bump of pgsql
16:19 < eea> but my php code is all super simple stuff
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16:26 < lts> Daily VM backups ftw, plus snapshot right before the upgrades
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17:09 < miah> fantastic! celebrate the 8th!
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17:59 < aaronm04> is there a portable version of httpd?
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18:07 < mischief> when's 7.6? i'm excited for it :D
18:07 < mischief> oh, nvm. i see the backlog now.. great news :-)
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20:40 < echelon> what virtual terminal does X work on?
20:40 < echelon> run on*
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20:40 < echelon> i did alt+ctrl+f1-f5 now i can't get back to my X session
20:45 < Bradipo> F5.
20:45 < Bradipo> That happens to me sometimes as well.  Not sure what the problem is.
20:46 < Bradipo> E.g. sometimes X misbehaves.  So I switch to ttyC0 and then when I try to switch back to C5 (using ctrl-alt-f5) it just goes blank and requires a reboot.
20:46 < echelon> Bradipo: ah, it was because of synergy, for some reason ctrl+alt+f5 wasn't working
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20:47 < echelon> until i switched out the physical usb keyboard/mouse switch
20:48 < echelon> how do i create additional screens in cwm
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21:21 < dfdx> does anyone offhand know how, in mdoc and tbl, to insert extra whitespace (i.e., a tab) into a cell within a tab? if not, no worries. just a shot in the dark.
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22:03 < aaronm04> echelon: I don't think it's possible
22:03 < aaronm04> you can group windows, which might be equivalent
22:03 < thrig> fvwm if you want virtual desktops
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22:13 < echelon> yes, that's what i mean.. virtual desktops
22:15 < pardis> too bad cwm(1) doesn't contain the phrase "virtual desktops"
22:15 < pardis> that would be helpful
22:16 < itrsea> echelon, start a new X server if the additional desktops are not sufficient desktops.
22:16 < Bradipo> That's an option for sure, but not nearly as convenient.
22:17 < Bradipo> Also, you cannot easily drag windows between 2 different X servers if I'm not mistaken.
22:17 < echelon> right
22:17 < itrsea> Bradipo: a great feature in some cases, I argue.
22:18 < Bradipo> But if you're going to start a new X server, it might as well be Xephyr.
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22:18 < itrsea> You may start processes between servers.
22:18 < echelon> maybe i should give dwm a go, i've used it for several years
22:18 < Bradipo> At least then you can nest it in your current session.
22:18 < Bradipo> I've recently started prefering just fvwm in base.
22:21 < itrsea> OpenBSD has a strong design, where the desktop adds less to the system than most systems. The only comparable OS would integrate only a single desktop.
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22:54 < mischief> i'm a fan of spectrwm, with its multiple workspaces
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23:13 < itrsea> mischief: you use a nice wm
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23:22 < sibiria> i really like cwm, but it could do with one or two small extra features
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--- Log closed Sat Oct 05 00:00:41 2024