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02:52 < Michelle> and another: Create /usr/ports/packages/sparc64/all/python-3.12.9.tgz
02:52 < Michelle> Error: Libraries in packing-lists in the ports tree and libraries from installed packages don't match (see DIAGNOSTICS in bsd.port.mk(5)
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02:53 < Michelle> should I just report these to the maintainer, any special stuff to report to them?  (Im assuming some of these are because its sparc64 - which they might not have access to hardware to check on)
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02:58 < vortexx> Michelle: packages are always built on the original to pick up issues like these. Best to report them indeed
02:59 < vortexx> (this is why it can take a few weeks for packages to appear for some older archs after the release is made)
02:59 < vortexx> those are pretty standard packages, strange you're getting mismatched libs
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03:04 < Michelle> vortexx, well this is a brand new 7.6 install in an LDOM on a T2550 and isc-bind won't start so I figured I'd build everything from scratch and see what happens.. no special options/favours etc where the install fails I just pkg_add it to move forward however now I've also run into a wall on that:
03:04 < Michelle> ftp: Error retrieving https://cdn.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/7.6/packages-stable/sparc64/python-3.12.9.tgz: 503 Service Unavailable
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03:11 < vortexx> try using a (not so) local mirror instead of the CDN, it's usually a lot more reliable
03:12 < Michelle> pointer on how to set please?
03:14 < vortexx> Michelle: change /etc/installurl to something off this list: https://www.openbsd.org/ftp.html
03:22 < vortexx> s/something off/something on
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12:43 < Michelle> vortexx, thanks for that earlier - sorry got busy with work - however now i've had a chance to look seems the sparc64 was last updated Oct 2024 and is 3.11.x which is the reason 3.12.x is not there..
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12:46 < Michelle> so that leaves me with fixing the current system and from a little bit of reading 'make print-package-args' has given a list . which is quite different from the install for example:
12:46 < Michelle> make reports:
12:46 < Michelle> --W sqlite3.37.32
12:46 < Michelle> +-W sqlite3.37.26
12:50 < Michelle> but make print-package-args gives (amongst other things):
12:50 < Michelle> -W sqlite3.37.32
12:51 < Michelle> so where is x.26 defined? - I am familiar and can create (and have maintainer on some) freebsd ports.. but not sure of openbsd ports... is there a primer?
12:52 < ninjin> Mentioned poor-ish performance with an Intel Atom x7425E processor last weekend. Can report that I achieved pretty much the same level of performance under Linux on the same machine, so this is clearly just the nature of the hardware. Did not want to spread undue claims that OpenBSD is orders of magnitude slower, because it is not.
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13:00 < vortexx> Michelle: sounds like you're mixing -current ports with -stable packages, which is a bad idea. python-3.12 will land with 7.7
13:00 < Michelle> probably - but that leaves with the problem of building -current stops because the versioning is incorrect
13:01 < RobbieAB> Is this a "pick either -current or -stable" situation?
13:02 < Michelle> literally I fresh installed 7.6 and started with the ports tree updated it with the cvs update (because of the missing python3 issue) and started building from scratch
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13:02 < vortexx> oh y'oure trying to build -current? You need to upgrade with sysupgrade -s to a snapshot, then you can build a release for -current and then do packages. Previous releases can't build snapshots usually
13:03 < Michelle> I'm (so far) 4 packages that won't build because of Error: Libraries in packing-lists in the ports tree and libraries from installed packages don't match (see DIAGNOSTICS in bsd.port.mk(5)
13:03 < vortexx> you can't mix the -current ports tree with 7.6 release, the libs won't be lined up
13:03 < Foxy_> Michelle: you need first upgrade your system to current, then use ports from current
13:03 < RobbieAB> Is there a release ports tree? 
13:03 < RobbieAB> Instead of current? 
13:04 < RobbieAB> This is mostly an area I haven't needed to explore so far.
13:04 < Michelle> ok just so everyone is aware: Sparc64 in an LDOM..
13:04 < Foxy_> RobbieAB: https://ftp.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/7.6/ports.tar.gz => ports tree for OpenBSD 7.6
13:04 < oldlaptop> Michelle: The ports tree is released in lockstep with the system. Everything breaks if you mix the -current ports tree with any base system other than -current.
13:05 < oldlaptop> On amd64, sparc64, luna88k, it doesn't matter.
13:05 < Michelle> so .. i blow it away and reinstall.. how do i get this working? need isc-bind installing using pkg_add does not work (as in the installed binary assert faults on start up)
13:05 < RobbieAB> Foxy_: That's a yes. :) Thank you.
13:06 < Foxy_> RobbieAB: see " OpenBSD Porter's Handbook" https://www.openbsd.org/faq/ports/
13:06 < vortexx> RobbieAB: yes every release gets it's own ports tree and updates for security patches on packages are pushed out to it via -stable
13:06 < renaud> What I generally do. Build full -release from -current, install that image, then build again -release from it. Then, install that last version.
13:06 < RobbieAB> Foxy_: Thank you. I will, though unless and until I actually need to engage with ports properly, it's likely only going to stick at a very shallow level.
13:07 < renaud> Altough, it's easier to wait for -release to be, actuelly, released
13:07 < RobbieAB> vortexx: Thank you too.
13:07 < vortexx> Michelle: do you have the logs of those faults? (presumably in /var/log/daemon)
13:07 < vortexx> you're welcome RobbieAB 
13:08 < RobbieAB> I am mostly just dipping my toe into openbsd (though I do like it a lot so far), but have decades experience with Linux, specifically Gentoo.
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13:09 < Michelle> ok so .. "pkg_delete -a && rm -r /usr/ports" should reset me, yes?  if so then download https://ftp.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/7.6/ports.tar.gz, unpack it to /usr/ports and I should be able to 'cd /usr/ports/net/isc-bind ; make install' and it'll (take a day or three) but work...? (and not stop with a failure trying to solve /usr/ports/lang/python/3 dependency broken issue) ...?
13:09 < oldlaptop> I don't know what you've done to this system, and therefore don't know what you would need to do to unbreak it.
13:09 < vortexx> well on OpenBSD the average user should be able to do just about everything with packages, ports are there if you really want to build your own (no optimizations available) I only do it to be able to sign my own packages
13:10 < vortexx> Michelle: pkg_delete -X
13:10 < Michelle> ok .. different from FreeBSD .. but yeah so that's the path
13:10 < Michelle> ?
13:10 < vortexx> but isc-bind should work
13:10 < vortexx> even on sparc64
13:11 < RobbieAB> vortexx: That is sort of the approach I am taking. packages cover most of my needs, if I start hitting really obscure ones... That would almost certainly mean someone decided to do openbsd at work. For personal stuff it should be simple enough.
13:11 < Michelle> oh hell no.. posted about that a few days ago
13:11 < vortexx> Michelle: ok I'll go dig in the logs then, sorry I wasn't aware you'd posted in detail
13:11 < vortexx> gimme 5 mins
13:12 < Michelle> favorite paste util?
13:13 < oldlaptop> There is not normally any reason to build from ports, given the availability of binary packages in the first place. (Non-mainstream arches won't necessarily have snapshot packages, especially.) If something really is broken at runtime, one might build from ports as part of the process of finding and fixing the problem with the port, but not as magic sauce to make it work.
13:13 < oldlaptop> The purpose of the ports tree is to build binary packages.
13:14 < RobbieAB> oldlaptop: Unless you are deep into trusting trust paranoia... 
13:14 < oldlaptop> There are two paste sites linked in the topic. I don't think anyone is likely to care what you use as long as it's capable of serving the raw content.
13:14 < Michelle> https://pastebin.com/raw/pCSJiF8w
13:14 < vortexx> Mon Apr 07 15:31:20 2025<.... Michelle> can't get isc_bind to start on a 7.6/sparc64 box ... errors out on an assertion: 07-Apr-2025 23:23:15.102 loop.c:602: REQUIRE(((loop) != ((void *)0) && ((const isc__magic_t *)(loop))->magic == ((('L') << 24 | ('O') << 16 | ('O') << 8 | ('P'))))) failed 
13:15 < vortexx> how much ram does this ldom have?
13:15 < Michelle> i see '3+ line pastes? Use a pas' :P
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13:15 < Michelle> I have one with 2G and one with 4G.. same error on both
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13:16 < vortexx> which should be more than enough
13:16  * oldlaptop wonders which IRC client this is. *sigh*
13:16 < vortexx> oldlaptop: mine? irssi
13:16 < oldlaptop> Does that show the whole channel topic?
13:16 < vortexx> yes
13:16 < vortexx> it was *one* long line
13:17 < vortexx> not 3+
13:17 < RobbieAB> It get's truncated in the top bar of my screen... However /topic gives me the full line
13:18 < Michelle> hey I haven't programmed anything on IRC since 1998 ... give me a break already - completely forgot about /topic!
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13:19 < vortexx> Michelle: the only difference I see is with the flags (this is on amd64): named[89711]: running as: named -t /var/named -u _bind -U 4
13:19 < vortexx> you have -U 10
13:19 < vortexx> or rather -d 10
13:19 < Michelle> (reckon i can still telnet into an IRC server (or openssl s_client -connect) and hold a convo though.. even now!
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13:20 < vortexx> oh that was debug level
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13:20 < Michelle> yup - that was me manually after it failed - and -U is depreciated
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13:21 < vortexx> my config file is ancient
13:21 < vortexx> it's for internal use only 
13:21 -!- ChanServ changed the topic of #openbsd to: Unofficial OpenBSD support channel; try to stay on topic | https://www.openbsd.org | https://www.openbsd.org/faq | Read These Fine Manual Pages (we can help find the right one): https://man.openbsd.org/ | Can't speak? https://libera.chat/guides/registration | 3+ line pastes? termbin.com, paste.debian.net, et al | No politics, etc.
13:22 < vortexx> anyway, I'd suggest installing a snapshot and building isc-bind in that to see if it works, and also maybe installing 7.5 to see if bind was still working there
13:22 < oldlaptop> maybe that can be golfed further :|
13:22 < Michelle> there's the whole log relating: https://pastebin.com/eaQd52m6
13:22 < Michelle> has -U4 and no -U and the -d 10
13:22 < oldlaptop> The assertion itself reads (entirely out of context) as though it could be an upstream endianness bug.
13:23 < oldlaptop> (normally such a thing that makes a package useless should still get it marked BROKEN or something)
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13:24 < oldlaptop> As disturbing as that would be in something like bind.
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13:26 < Michelle> well that was why I was trying to build it all from ports just incase it was something in the machine/hardware/ldom that was slightly different from the build server
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13:27 < Michelle> but the ports tree (without checking out the CVS tree) fails because lang/python/3 is missing
13:28 < Michelle> so you think the answer might be download an earlier version and try to pkg_add an earlier version of bind?
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13:29 < vortexx> yes, try an earlier release of OpenBSD to begin with (and if you have the patience install release by release to find out where it broke)
13:29 < oldlaptop> Your machine is not going to have different endianness from any other sparc box. (no I don't want to hear about that one weird Elbonian little-endian sparc workalike)
13:29 < Michelle> heh ok
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13:30 < vortexx> I'm booting my sparc64 qemu vm to see what version it is and if bind works
13:30 < Michelle> no I know the endianness is not changing... you reckon that is it though? Thought ISC was really good with regard to not getting that wrong
13:31 < oldlaptop> If you get a substantially different result because you built on a different machine, that's already a bug somewhere.
13:31 < Michelle> oldlaptop, 100%
13:31 < oldlaptop> I would be very unpleasantly surprised if my guess is correct.
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13:33 < oldlaptop> If you have/can share the configuration, I might be able to try it on one of these macppc boxes gathering dust around here.
13:33 < oldlaptop> (not today)
13:34 < Michelle> my bind config and zones you mean?
13:34 < oldlaptop> Yeah.
13:35 < oldlaptop> (Redacted as applicable, if that's a problem? I don't know/care nearly enough about bind's internals to have a good guess as to what, if anything, might impact that assertion)
13:36 < vortexx> I have an ultra1 gathering dust that hasn't been booted in 15+ years I could try and find the cables for
13:36 < Michelle> hmmm... i have the zones and config working elsewhere with no issue (including solaris10) but all earlier versions of bind currently
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13:37 < vortexx> trying pkg_add isc-named in 7.2 (the last release to work in qemu-sparc64), using the ne2k card is even slower than on the original hw lol
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13:38 < Michelle> I've got multiple U1s, U2, 20+ U5s a couple of U10s, a U30, a E250, E450, E280, 2 E3000s, 2E3500s and a E4000 in pieces .. not to mention all the 32bit machines including the original mirror.aarnet.edu.au and it's original disk trays and disks.
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13:39 < Michelle> (and no I'm not kidding... I'm going to be getting rid of it all over the next year)
13:39 < Michelle> don't need any of it anymore
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13:40 < vortexx> uh oh, the mirror doesn't have isc-bind
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13:42 < Michelle> (and yes anyone in NSW, Australia wants some of it.. message me and you can come pick some of it up)
13:42 < Michelle> (I'm in the Jervis Bay area)
13:42 < renaud> do you really need isc-bind? I mean, you have nsd and unbound from base. That might fit your requirements
13:43 < vortexx> then again it does but the VM is having issues
13:43 < Michelle> I do need bind
13:43 < Michelle> I don't need the latest bind, just a secure one
13:43 < RobbieAB> Michelle: How do you manage your zonefiles? vim?
13:44 < Michelle> no
13:44 < RobbieAB> We are looking for a sane way to manage bind zones.
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13:44 < Michelle> ok who am I showing up as?
13:45 < Michelle> ok mhix.org .. ok that makes sense
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13:45 < Michelle> ok I'm the pompous wanker that was behind SORBS all those years...
13:46 < renaud> I was also wonerding if your display name was that one
13:46 < RobbieAB> I was asking because you seem to be using bind so might have an option we missed... Ah, ok. :)
13:47 < Michelle> now you can all tell me to f*** off and run for the hills... 
13:47 < Michelle> but if not ... I have (had) the zone files built automatically from a backend DB using perl 
13:47 < RobbieAB> Yeah, you are doing something different. :)
13:48 < Michelle> i could re-write the whole thing and do something different - but i liked my DNS configuration stuff 
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13:49 < RobbieAB> You aren't administering zone files directly in the same way most DNS servers would be. It's cool. 
13:50 < Michelle> ..and sorry if that was inappropriate -but over the years the number of people who told me to go f**k myself because of SORBS is ridiculous and as it's shutdown now (not by *my* choice) I've kept it mostly to myself.
13:51 < vortexx> Michelle: you're using the -geopip version right?
13:51 < Michelle> RobbieAB, when you have 20+ DNS servers around the world that change occasionally you can't manage it by hand 
13:52 < Michelle> vortexx, yes
13:52 < vortexx> installing now
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13:53 < Michelle> (not necessarily needing the -geoip but as my new gig is doing geoip stuff figured i'd install it and see)
13:53 < RobbieAB> Michelle: Well, occassional changes can be done on the primary by hand... But we really don't want to require that changes have to be carried out by the few people competent to be allowed vim on a zonefile. :)
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13:55 < Michelle> RobbieAB, it sounds like you are looking for a solution and might have spotted something...? did i mis-read that? if so I'd need to untangle it but you're welcome to use my code if it'll solve issues for you
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13:57 < RobbieAB> Michelle: Well, we currently pay for a commercial software stack to run the primary, but... 
13:58 < rIMpossible> ]
13:59 < Michelle> what i build was tied into SORBS for user/pass/permissions etc (hence the untangle it bit) but it allowed webpage update/addition/deletion of zones which created bind config for inclusion and zonefiles for distribution - including master/slave configs depending on switches etc.  also it was FreeBSD/Solaris/Linux aware for locations...
14:00 < Michelle> s/for locations/for file locations/
14:00 < vortexx> ok isc-bind,geoip works
14:00 < vortexx> on 7.2 sparc64
14:00 < vortexx> I can't check later versions unfortunately
14:01 < oldlaptop> (qemu broke something?)
14:01 < Michelle> still downloading 7.5 here :D
14:01 < Michelle> eta 39m ... f**king NBN!
14:01 < renaud> 7.5? soon to be unsupported, why not 7.6?
14:02 < Michelle> *facepalm*
14:02 < vortexx> oldlaptop: yes. I don't know if it's OpenBSD or Qemu, but someone reported it in here 6 months ago and I filed a bug, but it didn't attract too much interest
14:02 < vortexx> renaud: 7.6 has a broken isc-bind apparently.
14:02 < vortexx> for sparc64
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14:04 < renaud> mybe it would be better to test -snapshot instead then
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14:08 < vortexx> renaud: that's been suggested, but it would be interesting to find out when this started breaking. oldlaptop reckons it might be an endianness issue
14:08 < renaud> sure, but if 7.7 work, I don't see why spending time finding where it brok at some point
14:08  * oldlaptop wildly guesses, based on that one assertion in the log file, that maybe there's an endianness problem
14:08 < oldlaptop> Sure would be a sad day.
14:09 < vortexx> Michelle: while you wait, have you tried starting bind without anything configured?
14:09 < Michelle> vortexx, was the first thing i did
14:09 < vortexx> good
14:09 < Michelle> minimal config
14:13 < RobbieAB> Michelle: Oh, I am sure your stuff works, but our goal is to find a solution with an upstream :D
14:14 < Michelle> RobbieAB, no worries
14:15 < RobbieAB> It might cause some serious "political problems" if my team suddenly start supporting our own web-app code in house.
14:15 < Michelle> RobbieAB, i don't care any which way - now just here looking for help and happy to give any i can.. which is not a lot as I have a 14m old now 
14:15 < Michelle> LOL!
14:16 < RobbieAB> Oooh, a fun age! That is about the point they realise they can fetch things mummy and daddy thought were out of reach.
14:16 < Michelle> yeah my new gig... apparently I was head hunted because anyone else doing what I do in the company is politically sensitive.. where I can steam roll to my hearts content
14:17 < RobbieAB> I almost got that gig in Motorola... After, as a contractor, I told one of their vendors engineering teams they were incompetent.
14:17 < Michelle> (not that I do, but i am getting things done where my staff have already said, they would have had issues)
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14:18 < vortexx> someone with the handle 'zayd' showed up here on the 19th of October complaining about not being able to install OpenBSD in qemu-sparc64 if you want to go through channel logs
14:19 < vortexx> some 24 years ago when I was a support weenie at an ISP, we were using zoneedit to manage zones for customers: https://www.zoneedit.com/
14:20 < vortexx> amazingly it's still around
14:20 < vortexx> (we were on bind, of course)
14:20 < vortexx> (solaris as the underlying OS iirc)
14:21 < RobbieAB> vortexx: That looks like a managed DNS service...
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14:22 < Michelle> vortexx, I wrote my DNS manager back in 2002/2003 at UQ and it included (still includes) MAC address entries so it can build isc-DHCP files
14:22 < vortexx> RobbieAB: it was just a tool at the time, they've clearly evolved since
14:22 < vortexx> Michelle: nice!
14:22 < RobbieAB> I think it looks more like someone is camping on the old brand
14:23 < RobbieAB> Michelle: Nice indeed.
14:23 < vortexx> I *think* we had a web frontend for zoneedit so the not so qualified people hired to just manage DNS entries could use it. Most of them had no idea it was vi underneath
14:23 < Michelle> vortexx, and the funny thing is apart from path changes in the remote it pretty much never changed from way back then
14:26 < vortexx> which is what you'd expect and hope for
14:26 < Michelle> built it with security in mind.. so you would run 'namedconf.pl' from cron as a user. and you'd put the last line in your named.conf to something like 'include /etc/namedb/named-database.conf' which was touched and chowned to the user you had cron'd namedconf.pl to ..
14:28 < IcePic> best property of such a dns helper tool is to remember to bump serial on changes. ;)
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14:28 < vortexx> IcePic: indeed :)
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14:29 < Michelle> IcePic, the web interface i built did that for you as soon as you modified the first entry.. then you had to hit 'update' to mark the zone ready for export
14:30 < Michelle> the only thing I never did right (at all) was versioning (as in recording historically)
14:31 < Michelle> one day I might re-write it all
14:32 < Michelle> (depends on whether i die of old age first or not :P )
14:33 < Michelle> ok its 00:33 here I'm going to bed.. will try 7.5 and 7.4 tomorrow
14:35 < vortexx> oldlaptop: https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-bugs&m=172980769606197&w=2 this was the last response I got, openfirmware using more memory issue for qemu-system-sparc64, kernel too close to limits. I tried a heavily trimmed kernel that was half the size of GENERIC and it didn't make a difference 
14:35 < vortexx> good night then Michelle and good luck tomorrow
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14:36 < renaud> it would be interesting to know when it broke, but even more interesting to see if it works in -current
14:39 < vortexx> 7.7 is just around the corner, it could be tested on that
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14:39 < vortexx> OPENBSD_7_7_BASE has been tagged
14:40 < renaud> but I think 7.7-release will be somewhat different than first tagging
14:40 < renaud> ssh 9.9 is quite weird as 10.0 is out
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14:44 < IcePic> well, with deprecations if might actually be correct to make such decisions right after tagging the release
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15:41 < anthk_> >Made uvideo(4) bypass unknown pixelformat to consumer rather than rejecting unknown driver formats.
15:41 < anthk_> good
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15:44 < vortexx> there's a new rpki-client out too post tagging, it's a bit odd
15:44 < Bradipo> What's odd about it?
15:50 < vortexx> Bradipo: that fairly important components of the OS get released after tagging of base
15:50 < vortexx> we'll see when the 7.7 release lands I guess
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16:25 < RobbieAB> vortexx: Unless they were waiting until immediately after the tagging so they get a cycle before being pushed into -release ?
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16:53 < vortexx> RobbieAB: maybe
16:56 < vortexx> so I thought it might be a good idea to have various OpenBSD/archs installed in qemu... just getting the installer booted for macppc is proving very difficult. I've done 6.5, 6.7, 7.5 and 7.6. Found an old post on the ml saying 6.1 works, going to try tht
16:56 < vortexx> the installer hangs during boot even with adb disabled
16:56 < RobbieAB> I have failed to get ppc64 running in qemu to my sorrow.
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17:04 < vortexx> yeah I'm surprised how difficult this is
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17:10 < IcePic> RobbieAB / vortexx: that could just mean that whatever "hw" qemu presents is not something likely to be found out in the real world, and noone in OpenBSD has yet to find coding against an emulator to be interesting enough to make platforms work well in qemu
17:13 < RobbieAB> IcePic: Ironically, openbsd will, allegedly, run on the bare metal of my ppc64 box, but there isn't a qemu configuration that matches it.
17:14 < RobbieAB> I haven't booted it to verify as I don't think the SAS controller has openbsd support, and I don't have non-SAS storage available.
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17:18 < IcePic> RobbieAB: I dont see that as ironical at all, whoever (kettenis probably) made the ppc64 port used a real box, and coded/ported drivers for the hw found on those, be it consoles, pci controllers and so on, but has not done that for qemu-ppc64
17:19 < ssm_> I got openbsd to boot on the risc-v mainboard and the results aren't promising from the ramdisk kernel, but I'll see how the full kernel does. none of the usb ports work, removing the tf card and reinserting it won't redetect the card, `cpu0: regulator not implemented` is particularly ominous, no entropy `random: boothowto does not indicate good seed`
17:20 < IcePic> entropy is not super dangerous, its just an indication of the bootloader not picking up an unused entropy file
17:20 < ssm_> s/risc-v mainboard/riscv64 deepcomputing fml13v01 mainboard/
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17:21 < vortexx> IcePic: yes I think it's fixing the qemu config to a real world machine that's the problem
17:21 < vortexx> I'm doing hppa right now, it's installing the sets
17:22 < RobbieAB> IcePic: The problem is qemu-ppc64 doesn't provide the same "POWER-NV" configuration the bare metal does. (not entirely unreasonable, but it means that I can't test openbsd in a VM on a linux install) And yes, it does appear to be kettenis.
17:22 < vortexx> https://chrispinnock.com/stuff/emulation/ <-- I'm using this guy's script since it does multiple OSes on multiple archs
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17:24 < vortexx> my flags are -M mac99,via=pmu -cpu g4 but I can't to the installer prompt, always hangs on various bits
17:24 < vortexx> https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-tech&m=153451249603835&w=2
17:27 < vortexx> s/can't/can't get
17:29 < aaronm04> can you set your default shell to something in ports _without_ risking getting locked out of your account if the port breaks?
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17:33 < RobbieAB> vortexx: Ah, macppc is separate. :)
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17:36 < phy1729> The only way something breaks ime is if you update base, don't update packages, then remove old but still used by packages libraries.
17:37 < phy1729> But you can also just reboot into single user mode
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17:41 < Bradipo> Well, if you remove old but still used by packages libraries, that shouldn't break you r ability to boot.
17:42 < Bradipo> Oh, I see, if you use a shell that's based on a package.
17:42 < Bradipo> Yeah, don't do that for root.
17:43 < vortexx> really not for root, as in some situations the /usr/local partition (or even /usr) may not be mounted
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17:45 < IcePic> aaronm04: one way is to have your ksh init file for root check that /usr/local/bin/shell-of-your-choice exists and is executable and so on, then it runs that. If that fails, you would fall back to ksh again
17:49 < aaronm04> oh yeah, I am talking about a regular user
17:49 < aaronm04> I think I should just make sure I can log in to root and not worry about this :)
17:50 < IcePic> still same, falling back in case fancyshell fails is probably better, especially from remote if you have doas set up
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18:02 < vortexx> ok hppa installed and booted in qemu but no networking, going to have to find which card works, dc0 gives timeouts only
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18:08 < aaronm04> IcePic: ok I'll do the ksh init file trick you described
18:09 < aaronm04> hmm, but is there an easy way to check if the shell has loaded all the shared libs it needs?
18:10 < aaronm04> or... it doesn't check and just drops me into the ksh shell when the shell from ports exits
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18:14 < thrig> easier is to exec fancyshell from the boring old shell, but that's more typing
18:16 < eea> 7.7 is coming soon already?!
18:16 < phy1729> aaronm04: just fooshell -c :
18:16 < eea> i still have at least 1 7.5 host to upgrade
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18:27 < aaronm04> phy1729: thank you!
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18:31 < BasketCase> aaronm04: you can test that 'fancyshell -c true' exits 0.
18:32 < BasketCase> (and that you are in a login ksh)
18:32 < aaronm04> thanks
18:33 < BasketCase> https://bpa.st/ONWQ is what I have
18:35 < vortexx> eea: it's pretty close, probably by the end of the month
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18:46 < eea> vortexx: thanks for confirming... i still haven't bought my 7.6 t-shirt either
18:46 < eea> <--fail.
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18:57 < vortexx> eea: you're welcome
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18:58 < thrig> all my openbsd tshirts have more holes than the default install
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18:59 < betabug> my only openbsd tshirt also has been around a heck of a long time
19:00 < BasketCase> my OpenBSD shirt has been around long enough that it is a polo not a T :P
19:03 < eea> i sorta have to get tshirt before upgrade... have a nice collection happening... kost of 5.x and all of 6.x, most of 7.x
19:03 < ssm_> fml13v01 boots into the snapshot GENERIC.MP kernel successfully. cpu regulator message is gone now thankfully. usb ports still don't work :(
19:03 < ssm_> can't figure out how to send files over XMODEM. trying the ~> escape with cat >file just reboots the system...?
19:03 < ssm_> can't even get ethernet since no usb ports work
19:04 < ssm_> I can transfer files very inefficiently by copying stuff to the tf card, but obviously that's not sustainable
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19:06 < ssm_> can play hangman(6), so honestly that's as much functionality as you need
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19:36 < tux0r> i miss the times when one could rely on openbsd releases being on 04/01 and 10/01
19:36 < tux0r> :|
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19:37 < phy1729> May and November
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19:44 < farhan> Hi all! I am reading the kernel configuration faq5, and See that to get the source tree I must run cvs -qd anoncvs...
19:44 < farhan> A) Can I just donwload the src.tar.gz and uncompress?
19:45 < farhan> B) What anonymous CVS URL should I use? pretty sure example.org isn't real.
19:45 < thrig> example.org is documented as being fake in some RFC
19:45 < farhan> Right! But, what URL should I use?
19:46 < thrig> a cvs server somewhere near you. there's a list on the website
19:46 < Bradipo> You can download src.tar.gz if you want, it's on the mirrors.
19:46 < vortexx> src.tar.gz is for releases, if you want -current you'll need cvs
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19:49 < farhan> I'm genuinely fine with either.
19:49 < jpb> just catching up here - was someone asking about booting sparc64 on qemu?
19:51 < IcePic> jpb: booting odd arches on qemu, sparc64, ppc64
19:52 < jpb> IcePic: yeah - i did a short write up on that as part of the QEMU virtualization chapter in the freebsd handbook
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19:53 < jpb> https://docs.freebsd.org/en/books/handbook/virtualization/#qemu-user-mode-emulation  describes how to setup qemu as a sparc64 machine, and boot a sparc64 image (all on an amd64 host)
19:54 < jpb> and i do recall discussing some booting issues with someone here, or on email.  if there's interest, lmk and i'll look it up.
19:57 < farhan> that's a confusing process...
20:00 < vortexx> jpb: I discovered that anything above 7.2 doesn't work
20:00 < vortexx> for OpenBSD on qemu-system-sparc64
20:00 < farhan> I'm having trouble finding the instructions to build the kernel...
20:01 < jpb> yeah, there was some issue - i'll dig in my email and look to see what it was.
20:01 < vortexx> farhan: man release
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20:03 < farhan> I installed the src.tar.gz via FTP. The second step says to cd to /sys/arch... I do not have a /sys directory
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20:05 < farhan> https://dpaste.com/5LYERZU3B The command from the man page does not seem to work?
20:05 < vortexx> jpb: here's the thread from by bug report six months ago  https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-bugs&m=172980769606197&w=2 
20:06 < vortexx> btw I had to use ne2k to get network working in qemu-system-sparc64, sunhme didn't work for me
20:07 < vortexx> ne2k_pci
20:07 < farhan> vortexx: the release page is wrong?
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20:08 < jpb> vortexx: might depend on the qemu version you use
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20:08 < IcePic> farhan: "man release" has good info 
20:09 < farhan> IcePic: The commands are not working on it for me...
20:09 < IcePic> farhan: and the softlink /sys should point to /usr/src/sys
20:09 < farhan> My fresh install does not have /sys
20:10 < farhan> IcePic: the cvs command present there doesn't work either: https://dpaste.com/5LYERZU3B
20:12 < IcePic> add "-d anoncvs@anoncvs.xx.openbsd.org:/cvs" so it makes a CVS/Root for you, where .xx is from the list of anoncvs servers
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20:12 < IcePic> the second command should be "cvs -d anoncvs@anon... up -r <actual tag here, not the word TAG> -Pd 
20:13 < IcePic> list of possible tags can be found here for instance, https://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/src/Makefile
20:13 < farhan> I see, that was not clear to me.
20:14 < IcePic> farhan: this page shows a few examples https://www.openbsd.org/anoncvs.html
20:14 < vortexx> jpb: yeah I imagine so, I'm on version 9.0.2 
20:14 < IcePic> with info like this: "If you are updating a source tree that you initially fetched from a different server, or from a tar file, you must add the -d [cvsroot] option to cvs."
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20:17 < farhan> memset: how do you feel about bzero?
20:17 < Bradipo> Hahaha, you very clever.
20:18 < farhan> I learned bzero first, only later did I get warnings that bzero would eventually go away. Never happened.
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20:32 < vortexx> ok this is weird, sunhme works now. Maybe I passed the wrong option last time
20:34 < vortexx> it's still slow as mollasses but that's fine
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20:36 < jpb> bah! - can't find old notes about sparc64 boot issues on old releases.  sorry.
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20:39 < farhan> I think I got it compiling, but I had to use ChatGPT. Respectfully, I think the kernel build process could be made easier to follow.
20:39 < farhan> The manual was not clear to me and seemed to require some "tribal knowledge".
20:39 < farhan> Very respectful intended.
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20:43 < Bradipo> I've only ever had to use release...
20:43 < Bradipo> Though, it has been a while since I tried last, so perhaps it has changed.
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21:04 < vortexx> not having networking for hppa is annoying, time to move on to some other arch
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21:08 < jpb> vortexx: for that article, i downloaded and tried about 5 different releases from planetunix.net.
21:09 < jpb> oh - btw - i did find a reference to the booting problem.  it was something about "no space for symbol table".  it was fixed in an earlier release, then broke again.  not sure where things are right now.
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21:16 < WhyNotHugo> how do i handle someone tapping the physical power button on my host?
21:16 < Bradipo> Epoxy?
21:17 < WhyNotHugo> Ah, 
21:17 < WhyNotHugo> acpibtn.4
21:17 < Bradipo> This will pretty much prevent them from pressing it: https://www.pcepoxy.com/products/permanent-repair/pc-7-paste-epoxy/
21:19 < WhyNotHugo> The default are machdep.pwraction=1 hw.allowpowerdown=1, seems to do exactly what i needed
21:19 < WhyNotHugo> Bradipo: That's what the lock in the closet is for
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21:36 < vortexx> jpb: yes apparently the kernel is too close to the limits for that, I tried with heavily trimmed GENERIC custom kernel and it made no difference unfortunately
21:36 < anelli> so i got a home server with smtpd and receiving email works well but sending doesn't due to rdns ofc. i got a vps up and i'm wondering should i move my smtpd config there or configure it as a relay for outbound mail? i wish to keep as much stuff as possible on my main machine but i'm now to smtpd so i'm wondering if this is feasible to do
21:37 < anelli> s/now/new
21:39 < anelli> WhyNotHugo: i think they can just get in the case or unplug psu?
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21:44 < vortexx> ne2k_pci in qemu-sparc64: [  5]   0.00-10.43  sec  11.2 MBytes  9.05 Mbits/sec                  sender
21:44 < vortexx> [  5]   0.00-10.57  sec  11.2 MBytes  8.93 Mbits/sec                  receiver
21:45 < vortexx> sunhme in same VM: 35 Mbits/sec on average
21:45 < vortexx> quite a lot better
21:46 < WhyNotHugo> anelli: i wanted to make sure that pressing the button does a *clean* shutdown
21:48 < anelli> WhyNotHugo: ooh haha i thought you were killing the shutdown button
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22:00 < ssm_> I can't get XMODEM (~X escape) working over serial line with cu, either to real hardware over cua(4) or over ttypa to a vm under vmm(4). I get prompted for a local file, and when supplied it just hangs forever.
22:00 < ssm_> I can interrupt out of it but that's it
22:01 < ssm_> trying the ~> escape to send a file is seemingly nonfunctional too, it just dumps output to stdout instead of a file; and when using something like `cat >file` to capture the input it produces a lot of garbage (control sequences maybe?)
22:03 < ssm_> maybe I need to stty raw first...
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22:08 < ssm_> nope, rebooted
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22:15 < vortexx> ssm_: never tried that, wish I could help. Strange it's not working
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22:22 < ssm_> I think I can use ~> to copy the files if I can disable control chars, so maybe it won't even matter
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22:22 < ssm_> the fact you need to disable control chars should probably be in the cu(1) manpage if that's the case
22:23 < vortexx> https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-misc&m=144407982815533&w=2 says you need something listening on the other side, such as lrz
22:24 < ssm_> hmm okay; I'll to copy the package (and dependencies) with the tf card, but hopefully that's the last time I'll need to do that
22:28 < vortexx> if you really wanted to make the effort you could setup pppd on each end to have tcp/ip
22:29 < ssm_> you can do stuff like that? guess I'll try that then
22:29 < ssm_> I'm still new to serial connections
22:30 < ssm_> would be nicer than cavemanning stuff over from an ftp mirror and figuring out the whole dependency tree
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22:36 < vortexx> I just checked the manpage, it can be done. It's the recommended method now that slip got tedu'd
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22:37 < ssm_> it looks simple enough. what I was surprised about was the lack of a rc.d entry
22:38 < ssm_> checked x86 as well in case it was just absent on riscv64
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22:38 < vortexx> maybe it's because it's configured via hostname.if ?
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22:38 < ssm_> yeah but it's ppp<d> >:(
22:40 < mischief> you can run ppp over a uart but then you also get to deal with the speed of the uart :-)
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22:58 < Michelle> morning all
22:58 < vortexx> morning Michelle , ready to start testing previous releases in the ldom?
22:59 < Michelle> OpenBSD 7.5 (GENERIC.MP) #2091: Wed Mar 20 18:55:09 MDT 2024
22:59 < Michelle>     deraadt@sparc64.openbsd.org:/usr/src/sys/arch/sparc64/compile/GENERIC.MP
22:59 < Michelle> real mem = 2147483648 (2048MB)
22:59 < vortexx> does isc-bind work?
22:59 < Michelle> waiting for a login prompt as we type
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23:01 < vortexx> nice
23:02 < Michelle> and no sparc64 packages for 7.5 on CDN :P (found a mirror)
23:02 < Michelle> 2
23:02 < Michelle> oopps
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23:05 < vortexx> I've just noticed syspatch isn't supported on sparc64
23:06 < vortexx> you have to cvs and build new kernel + userland to stay up to date, that's fun on such old hw
23:06 < Michelle> vampire# rcctl start isc_named
23:06 < Michelle> isc_named(ok)
23:06 < vortexx> is that with your full config?
23:07 < Michelle> nope - default/minimal config (same as i was testing with on 7.6)
23:07 < vortexx> ssm_: https://undeadly.org/cgi?action=article;sid=20040221205008 I found this old write up, you can strip away all the modem stuff. 
23:08 < vortexx> Michelle: ok then you have at least proof it runs
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23:09 < vortexx> I guess you might want to try a snapshot next, to see if 7.7-current works (whilst we wait for 7.7-release to land)
23:09 < Michelle> https://pastebin.com/raw/vTsMJELf
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23:10 < vortexx> 7.5 will be supported till 7.7 but you won't get security updates for packages
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23:11 < Michelle> yeah might setup a -current to see however this is where i wanted to be, that way i can now get everything off an HP DL380G7 that's failing
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23:11 < vortexx> yes, pleased to see you got it all working without too many complications
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23:13 < Michelle> speed is not an issue here - reliability is, and now its up I can start getting rid of more hardware and shrink my footprint .. the main issue being I can't get away from Solaris 10 in the short term, otherwise I'd just fire up a bunch of Pi's
23:13 < vortexx> mh odd, gnome-control-center can't find a header file and won't compile in 7.7, which means I can't finish compiling gnome. Going to wait till a patch or the packages builders have binaries that work I guess
23:18 < vortexx> Michelle: solaris 10? That's getting rather old in the tooth but if it just keeps working I guess why not?
23:19 < tux0r> the most obvious migration path from solaris 10 would be illumos though
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23:22 < Michelle> vortexx, yup, but it has an application on it that i need and i don't have source to compile it so i have to keep running it (it should work on Solaris 11 as well - eventually I'll get around to seeing if I can get that installed, but in the mean time the application is exposed to the internet, the OS is not so do I really need to f**k with it?
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23:23 < vortexx> Michelle: clearly not. 
23:23 < Michelle> :)
23:27 < Michelle> I'm a great believer in "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"... I also spent 20+ years running SORBS on my own dealing with my own security policies and at one point only Microsoft was seeing more targeted hack-attacks that me.. i never got hacked and I'm quite proud of that :)
23:31 < vortexx> agreed, never touch anything that just keeps working. Nice going on not getting hacked, so many did
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23:42 < oldlaptop> <Michelle> and no sparc64 packages for 7.5 on CDN :P (found a mirror)
23:42  * oldlaptop wonders idly whether one or more of the CDNs might randomly have or not have them
23:43 < oldlaptop> different mirrors differ in exactly what they keep for which old releases
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23:43 < oldlaptop> (IcePic's is the best, IIRC >:))
23:45 < oldlaptop> (ftp.eu.openbsd.org, again IIRC - judging by the autoindex I probably do RC)
23:47 < oldlaptop> http://ftp.eu.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/2.3/packages/sparc/ doesn't seem like a whole lot of packages, but it does match i386!
23:47 < vortexx> yes, IcePic's is the best
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--- Log closed Tue Apr 15 00:00:43 2025