--- Log opened Wed Apr 16 00:00:44 2025
00:00 < dlg> technically dhcp is a udp protocol
00:01 < dlg> which pf does handle
00:01 < dlg> in practice dhcp programs use bpf and handle udp/ip packets directly
00:02 < dlg> bpf happens way before pf is run, so pf doesnt get a chance to filter it
00:02 < dlg> dhcpv6 should be using normal sockets though, so pf should affect it
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01:33 < echelon> any plans for openbsd on apple's m processors?
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01:34 < WhyNotHugo> echelon: a few are supported: https://www.openbsd.org/arm64.html
01:34 < echelon> awesome, thanks
01:35 < oldlaptop> it doesn't sound like particularly desirable hardware to me if you want to run anything apple doesn't ship with it
01:35 < oldlaptop> but clearly some of the right people want it badly enough :)
01:35 < echelon> if i just want to run a server?
01:36 < vortexx> just get a mac mini then, amd64 or arm64
01:36 < oldlaptop> when did apple last make hardware desirable for running as a server? :P
01:36 < oldlaptop> core2 days?
01:36 < oldlaptop> (maybe the mini counts-ish)
01:36 < vortexx> about then yes, xservers
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01:36 < echelon> yeah, i was talking about the minis
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01:37 < vortexx> and everyone pointed out apple's record in the server world and was proven correct when the xservers were discontinued
01:38 < oldlaptop> wherever will we go for that brushed-aluminum rack now?
01:39 < oldlaptop> (too harsh?)
01:39 < vortexx> s/xserver/xserve
01:39 < vortexx> The Xserve is a discontinued series of rack-mounted servers that was manufactured by Apple Inc. between 2002 and 2011.
01:41 < oldlaptop> I guess that extends slightly past core2 days, then.
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01:41 < oldlaptop> (if not necessarily to post-core2 machines?)
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01:52 < vortexx> On April 7, 2009 Xserve was updated to use Intel Xeon ('Gainestown') processors, <-- core2 still? that's the final rev
01:53 < oldlaptop> I think so
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01:55 < oldlaptop> Ah, no - nehalem
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01:57 < vortexx> ssm_: this may be of use in your ppp endeavours: https://jcs.org/2020/09/03/wifi232_ppp
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11:49 < tyfon> I have been searching for quite a bit but I can't find any answers online. My dhcp server (ISC-v4) sends option 119 search domain to it's clients. This is verified by wireshark and works on most other dhcpclients except for systemd-networkd in linux (without special options in config). dhcpleased and resolvd seems to ignore this value completely. I can't find any references to it on the web or in manpages. 
11:49 < tyfon> This worked fine with dhlient. Does anyone have a clue if this is something that should be supported? I can only find reference in dhcpleased.h but the defined value is not used anywhere in the source).
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12:44 < aaronm04> have you checked the relevant rfc?
12:46 < aaronm04> oh looks like there are 5 different ones at least
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12:58 < vortexx> tyfon: you might want to mail at a minimum misc@ about that, if not tech@ if it's a missing feature
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13:01 < tyfon> vortexx: i've been looking at the source, I think it's actually missing. It's handling the domain name but not search domain. I see the same with the leased runfile. I'll give a shot at coding it myself first I think :)
13:02 < tyfon> I'll have to figure out how to communicate it to resolvd too
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13:24 < vortexx> tyfon: if you can submit a patch that's even better. I presume you could reuse dhcpleased's code to pass to resolvd the domain?
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13:34 < tyfon> vortexx: I need to figure how it's all put together. I'll submit it if I get it to work and it looks safe :)
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14:18 < vortexx> best of luck tyfon 
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15:02 < morpho> has anybody got openbsd to work on an old (2013) macbook pro 13"
15:02 < morpho> can get them cheaper than thinkpads on ebay is all
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15:09 < vortexx> morpho: https://dmesgd.nycbug.org/index.cgi?do=index&fts=macbook+pro not really seeing it on the list here
15:09 < vortexx> also of late (like the past year) there's been reports in here of not being able to boot Macbooks
15:09 < morpho> ah, shame
15:10 < morpho> thanks for linking me this site
15:10 < sibiria> works fine
15:10 < vortexx> if you're looking for old laptops, I've had a lot of luck with Dell XPS 13s over the years
15:10 < vortexx> (you might have to swap out the wifi card)
15:11 < vortexx> 13", under 1.5kg, usually everything works (apart from bluetooth of course)
15:11 < sibiria> i used to run it on my 2009 mbp. acquaintance of mine ran it on a 2015 or 2014 mbp
15:11 < morpho> my x60 and x230 still work
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15:11 < sibiria> broadcom wifi was a mess, from my memory
15:12 < morpho> but x270 needs new parts and im kind of looking for a new computer
15:12 < quinq> sent from my X230
15:12 < sibiria> the intel macbooks are after all technically pretty much standard x86 UEFI hardware
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15:12 < morpho> sibiria are you using one?
15:12 < sibiria> not anymore
15:13 < quinq> What happened?
15:14 < sibiria> nothing. openbsd just wasn't a great desktop experience for a laptop
15:14 < sibiria> wifi not working was a dealbreaker, though
15:14 < sibiria> it's been a few years, maybe the driver is functional these days
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15:15 < vortexx> OpenBSD did save my bacon getting my FFTH line activated with upstream I have to say, so much easier setting up the vlan+dhcp on the laptop 
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15:15 < vortexx> otherwise I don't normally use it for day to day stuff
15:16 < vortexx> sibiria: usually not
15:16 < vortexx> if support hasn't landed in the first year or two it's not going to
15:16 < sibiria> usually not, no. wifi on openbsd is well below par
15:16 < vortexx> and usb wifi sticks seem to be stuck in the 2010s
15:17 < vortexx> if not late 2000s
15:17  * vortexx is watching 7.2 on qemu-system-sparc64 churn out it's first syspatch. Fingers crossed it works
15:18 < vortexx> 39 syspatches to build for 7.2
15:19 < IcePic> sounds like "cvs to patched to 7.2, build kernel,base and x11" and it will be three builds
15:19 < vortexx> it's just to see how well it works
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15:20 < vortexx> otherwise of course I could just build a 7.2-stable release
15:21 < vortexx> (it'd be nice if I could crosscompile from amd64 to sparc64 but I know that's frowned upon)
15:21 < IcePic> you can do it as much as you like, but bug reporting stuff after cross-building is whats frowned upon
15:22 < IcePic> something something "if you break it, you get to keep both pieces"
15:22 < vortexx> true
15:22 < vortexx> I still have no idea how to do it
15:22 < vortexx> :)
15:23 < IcePic> I think the kernel is easier, its very much self contained. The base depends a lot on all odd pieces (like gcc/llvm) to pick up on the altered env, so getting whole of base crossed can be an issue
15:25 < vortexx> yeah I'm not even sure llvm can be compiled for sparc64
15:25 < IcePic> make a large partition/mfs on /usr/cross, then cd /usr/src and "make TARGET=sparc64 cross-tools" or something like that. 
15:25 < IcePic> vortexx: well, cross-tools would build what is appropriate for the target 
15:25 < vortexx> ok thanks, I'll have to try that
15:26 < IcePic> but what I meant is that /usr/src/bin/ls is nice and picks up the correct stuff from the env, if CC points to not-gcc-not-clang, but making sure groff or gcc or binutils doing it is not as certain
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15:28 < IcePic> vortexx: check /usr/src/Makefile and Makefile.cross for some help
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15:29 < vortexx> thanks for all the info, I'll look at it while syspatch churns
15:29 < vortexx> systemdsucks: have you tried 7.7 on your macbook pro? (just checked the logs and this is the person who reported a 2015 machine not working with 7.6 bsd.rd)
15:29 < IcePic> the trick is that if/when you have the compiler and all done under /usr/cross/<arch>/something-something done, you need to set all the CC,AS,LD and so on with the output from "cd /usr/src; make TARGET=sparc64 cross-env" which will vomit out a lot of those vars correctly for you 
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15:31 < morpho> sibieria i have found openbsd wifi to be pretty good
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15:32 < morpho> id get packetloss and disconnects on linux, only 802.n speeds on freeBSD
15:32 < Bradipo> It's pretty good as long as what you're using is supported.
15:32 < Bradipo> I bought 5 USB wifi adapters (different brands each) and none of them worked.
15:33 < morpho> what tech wifi?
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15:35 < vortexx> morpho: on which chip?
15:35 < sibiria> 802.11 n/ac is barely supported on openbsd. it only works well-ish on some of the intel cards. anything else claiming 11n support in reality does not work
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15:39 < systemdsucks> vortexx: I did try a snapshot a couple of weeks ago but it didn't boot 
15:39 < vortexx> plus the speeds when the card works are like half if not one tenth the speed on linux
15:39 < systemdsucks> so I only upgraded to 7.6
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15:39 < vortexx> systemdsucks: ok thanks for the update!
15:39 < systemdsucks> and now I'm waiting for release
15:39 < systemdsucks> vortexx: thanks for your concern good sir
15:40 < vortexx> oh so 7.6 did work in the end?
15:40 < vortexx> you're welcome
15:40 < systemdsucks> it boots but that takes like three hours
15:40 < systemdsucks> at least it's ready in case 7.7 actually boots
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15:43 < vortexx> three hours... that really is unusual. 
15:44 < vortexx> 7.7 is just around the corner
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15:53 < morpho> what another good box for openbsd?
15:54 < morpho> i have seen these panasonic toughpads that are a x86 tablet basically
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15:58 < vortexx> morpho: try using the nycbug dmesg site, it's great for working out if certain models work or not
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16:18 < WhyNotHugo> the dmesg command prints out multiple repetitions of the dmesg; how do I print just the last one?
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16:27 < morpho> eeepc are so gnarly
16:28 < Bradipo> WhyNotHugo: What do you mean "the last one"?
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16:35 < vortexx> Bradipo: the last booted one
16:35 < vortexx> I've noticed this too and am not sure why it happens, and it's a bit random too
16:36 < vortexx> maybe /var/run/dmesg.boot isn't getting deleted on reboot/halt
16:36 < vortexx> ?
16:36 < BasketCase> or you are on a platform that doesn't wipe RAM on reboot
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16:49 < tuplario> dmesg | uniq?
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17:54 < IcePic> tuplario: that would not help, |uniq only removes equal lines following eachother, and multiple dmesgs mean you have complete dmesgs following each other, so having two lines being equal would basically not happen
17:57 < vortexx> you'd need something to jump to the last GENERIC.MP/GENERIC line and show everything after that
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18:05 < gnucode> odd question...
18:05 < gnucode> the Linux graphics module for the new Apple ARM hardware...
18:05 -!- fart_cat [~fart_cat@user/fart-cat:36778] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:05 < gnucode> is written in Rust.
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18:06 < gnucode> I wonder if OpenBSD would use try to port that Rust code...or rewrite it in C...  I actually don't even know if the code is appropriately licensed or not...
18:08 < morpho> at this point... who cares
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18:09 < morpho> i know its more complicated than that, but AI stealing code seems to be more of a issue towards license violations
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18:20 < gnucode> morpho:   "Al stealing code"...what?  I was not aware of code stealing...
18:20 < gnucode> ohhh... not Al...A.I.
18:20 < gnucode> gotcha.
18:21 < quinq> AI Bundy
18:21 < morpho> Might as well be
18:25 < sibiria> WhyNotHugo: that's normal. var-run-dmesg.boot will contain last and current session
18:25 < thrig> wierd AI yankovich
18:26 < sibiria> WhyNotHugo: and if you meant that some things print repeated lines to the syslog, you can instruct syslogd to compound those
18:26 < sibiria> give it "-r" option via rcctl
18:26 < anexit> plasma 6 run well on openbsd?
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18:28 < WhyNotHugo> sibiria: it's okay to send the dmesg like that? the previous iteration lacked firmware, so i think output changed
18:30 < sibiria> i don't think anyone reads mails sent to dmesg@ unless some troubleshooting is going on...
18:30 < sibiria> you can trim the contents yourself and mail it manually
18:32 < tyfon> So I managed to get the dhcp option 119 implemented and parse the search domains according the rfcs in a safe manner and added it to the /var/db/dhcpleased files. But resolvd of course only looks at routing propsals for nameservers :P
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18:36 < sibiria> resolvd is still a piece of junk
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18:41 < tyfon> I'm tempted to make dhcpleased write to resolv.conf directly.., but I guess this would not be a public patch
18:41 < morpho> some linux distros do that
18:41 < morpho> well annoying
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18:42 < tyfon> At least they support these options.. But I could just add the search option manually to resolv.conf and it sticks
18:43 < tyfon> I just don't want to type out the full domain name for the machines on my lan :P
18:43 < tyfon> So instead I have spent like 4 hrs reading rfcs and programming
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19:01 < vortexx> tyfon: congrats on getting it mostly working!
19:02 < vortexx> I dunno if anyone has tried making their own syspatches before, the first patch appears to be building a whole release, this is going to take a day or two at these speeds (like late 90s speeds). Shame I can't assign more cores via a SMP sparc64 config but I never managed to get those to boot
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19:16 < WhyNotHugo> the first time that I try to reach some external hosts via ipv6, they time out. subsequente connections to the same host work fine immediately
19:16 < WhyNotHugo> it only happens on hosts behind my openbsd router, but not on the router itself
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19:17 < WhyNotHugo> e.g.: `curl -6 https://google.co` times out, but the second attempt works immediately. the same is true for any domain
19:19 < WhyNotHugo> curl -v shows that dns resolution completes almost instantly, it's the actual connection itself that fails to establish
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20:03 < farhan> Hi all! I am having trouble understanding the queue set of macros. specifically SIMPLEQ_INIT
20:04 < farhan> https://dpaste.com/6GAWPE8CS
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20:04 < farhan> I do not understand this error message. How is the structure not a structure?
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20:07 < farhan> I'm such an idiot...I see the issue
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20:32 < brutex> vortexx: for an menuentry "OpenBSD 7.6" { insmod part_gpt insmod search_fs_uuid insmod chain chainloader /EFI/OpenBSD/BOOTX64.EFI } where to put BOOTx64.EFI from Linux to mount Windows partition i have read some guide to remember something, for Windows to mount efi windows dir in /mnt or to copy BOOTx64.EFI to /boot in Linux partition Ubuntu i mean for dual boot, that you have told me, what 
20:32 < brutex> to do.. if you are here.. ?
20:33 < brutex> because im not sure
20:33 < brutex> foro an entries parameters there are for 40_custom and then update-grub
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20:43 < farhan> I figured it out...
20:43 < farhan> ugh, I Find queue very confusing and I'm not sure why
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20:52 < vortexx> brutex: on ubuntu your efi partition is already mounted in /boot/efi/
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20:52 < brutex> vortexx: yes
20:52 < brutex> vortexx: then where to copy BOOTX64.EFI
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20:53 < brutex> in windows efi dir
20:53 < brutex> or?
20:54 < vortexx> mkdir /boot/efi/EFI/OpenBSD && cp path/to/BOOTX64.EFI /boot/efi/EFI/OpenBSD
20:54 < brutex> yes but in Windows or Linux
20:55 < brutex> after mounted Windows partition
20:55 < vortexx> that is in linux
20:55 < brutex> ah ok
20:55 < brutex> now i understand you
20:55 < brutex> thank you
20:55 < vortexx> you're welcome
20:56 < vortexx> mounting the ESP partition in Windows I don't know how to do but I'm sure there's docs on that
20:57 < brutex> yes
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21:05 < vortexx> another satisfied customer :)
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21:24  * sonya hopes that any changes to boot/installboot will be stated in changelog for 7.7 if any.. especially if there's a chance to break (default) windows (10/11) boot..
21:25 < sibiria> you can just make a copy of your default boot application first
21:25 < sibiria> cp -pR /path/to/esp/EFI/BOOT BOOT_backup
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21:30 < ROYGBYTE> vortexx, how many Customer Satisfaction Awards does that make for you now?
21:31 < vortexx> sonya: apparently it claims preeminence over over OSes but a lot of machines use a different file to boot Windows, bootmgfw.efi in EFI/Microsoft/Boot
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21:31 < vortexx> ROYGBYTE: dunno, I don't really try to keep count
21:31 < sonya> not sure, that it's enough.. right now i'm booting obsd from usb-miniroot, my efi partition (100Mb msdos) already have obsd's EFI/Boot/{BOOTIA32,BOOTX64}.EFI but default (when usb-miniroot unplugged) is windows.. and i wish to keep it as it is.. messing with refind or grub is not the way i'd prefer in any way..
21:32 < vortexx> I hope it'll keep working
21:33 < sonya> so am i..
21:33 < vortexx> it's the kind of thing even testing under virtualization isn't a 100% sure metho
21:33 < vortexx> s/metho/method
21:33 < sibiria> wouldn't refind be less of a mess?
21:34 < sibiria> i find it a rather elegant solution
21:35 < sonya> refind is ok, but it has some.. disadvantages.. because windows has a habit rewrite all to it's own.. may be it's a local issue..
21:37 < sibiria> that sounds like a disadvantage of having windows installed :)
21:38 < sonya> indeed.. but i like games..
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21:40 < Bradipo> sonya: I hear there are some good ones in /usr/games
21:40 < sonya> oh yeah.. why else i installed obsd? :)
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21:45 < thrig> pkg_add trader
21:45 < systemdsucks> is that like dopewars?
21:50 < vortexx> windows will indeed reinstall boot files on it's own without telling you, usually at feature update time but sometimes other times too
21:51 < vortexx> pkg_add freeciv 
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21:55 < vortexx> triple boot can sometimes get really fun I can tell you :P
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21:58 < thrig> you may need a Tripel beverage to cope
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22:05 < tvtoon> remove the first Windows partition if you have one, and the backup ones it put ahead on the disk, try this
22:06 < tvtoon> the smaller ones that look like EFI partitions
22:06 < tvtoon> and turn off secure boot if you hadn't already
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22:31 < Vuokko> Hi!
22:32 < Vuokko> How can I control NL and CR translation in cu?
22:33 < Vuokko> I receive only newlines so my lines run away to right
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22:35 < uwharrie> cu doesn't care about that, it's a function of the terminal. check stty(1)
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23:42 < vortexx> stty really helps making serial connection confortable in large terminals, I'd forgotten about it till I started messing with sparc64 stuff
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--- Log closed Thu Apr 17 00:00:45 2025