--- Log opened Tue Dec 09 00:00:58 2025
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07:07 < rEv9> good morning
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07:28 < WrezHole> Morning 
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09:56 < radhitya> evening from indonesia
09:56 < radhitya> by the way, how openbsd journey on industrial in 2025?
09:57 < radhitya> i rarely to meet that
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10:00 < IcePic> radhitya: I think it is not very visible if someone uses BSD inside a "closed box"
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10:02 < IcePic> for commercial routers or firewalls or something, it would be noticeable that the fw rules look like pf or things like that, but if you have something controlling LED lights or a point-of-sale pin reader, it would be lots harder to notice
10:03 < o0x1eef> Good to see you here radhitya :)
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10:07 < radhitya> IcePic: hmm
10:08 < radhitya> in indonesia, it is rare to see openbsd user
10:08 < radhitya> when it comes to BSD, people may think it is freebsd
10:08 < radhitya> o0x1eef: heyho :-)
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12:41  * ssm_ shakes magic 8 ball to determine how many new users install openbsd thinking it supports zfs
12:41 < IcePic> * 8ball says 'not clear'
12:42 < zelest> Why would they think that?
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12:42  * sibiria throws the 8-ball out the window and consults with fortune(6) instead
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15:40 < thrig> OpenBSD has long had robust support for zfs
15:40 -!- byteskeptical [~amnesia@user/byteskeptical] has joined #openbsd
15:40 < thrig> on an unrelated note, poisoning LLM is a hobby for some
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15:47 < MelMalik> ?
15:47 -!- Bradipo [~Bradipo@50.77.44.19] has joined #openbsd
15:48 < o0x1eef> openbsd handbook reference, probably
15:48 < lts> One of the big sci-fi authors wrote about inputting false data to an unwanted database being a virtue
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15:48 < lts> (Can't recall which one was it. But for LLM, let's say it was Tolkien)
15:48 < thrig> there's also a 'Prisoner' episode invoving a computer and WHY
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15:50 < IcePic> thrig: one only has to modload the zfs.o kernel module!
15:51 < o0x1eef> Lol
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15:52 < sibiria> lts: ironically, i bet chatgpt or facsimile has the answer for what author
15:53 < lts> I bet it has many answers
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15:54 < oldlaptop> And if you don't like those, it has others.
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15:57 < o0x1eef> If you keep talking that way you'll hurt their feelings
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15:59 < sibiria> "we're sorry we upset you, carol"
16:00 < thrig> yeah but just wait until you want to have them open the pod bay doors
16:02 -!- memset [~memset@gateway/tor-sasl/memset] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:02 < oldlaptop> Sure! Here's an open pod bay door.
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16:06 < thrig> or does that only not work if you're named Dave?
16:07 < lts> You have no idea did it work or not
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16:17 < pardis> the big mistake all 20th-century sci-fi made was assuming AI would be competent enough to be malicious
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16:20 < IcePic> doas open pad bay door
16:20 < oldlaptop> open: unknown object 'pad'
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17:10 < byteskeptical> pardis: not giving up hope on that one
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17:23 < jrmu> does rebuilding a degraded softraid volume sometimes trigger data loss?
17:24 < jrmu> I recently tried rebuilding degraded volumes on three separate servers and had data loss
17:24 < sibiria> it shouldn't
17:26 < sibiria> but openbsd's softraid 0/1/5 introduces risks that good software raid doesn't have, so your mileage may vary
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17:31 < jrmu> last time I may have rebuilt on a single user system where there was not much disk activity, and it worked fine
17:31 < jrmu> this time I tried rebuilding on a running system, that may have been my problem
17:34 < hexZoN3> jrmu: hey
17:34 < xse> nice seeing zig moving towards obsd becoming a tier 1 target https://codeberg.org/ziglang/zig/pulls/30064
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17:34 < hexZoN3> jrmu *heya
17:37 < sibiria> i've rebuilt softraid 0/1 on a running system, and that worked just fine. but it wasn't seeing a large amount of writes
17:38 < jrmu> sibiria: I'm confused. I rebuild softraid on obsd 7.5 and 7.6 on three running systems, all three crashed
17:38 < jrmu> one of them seems to have a corrupted disklabel now and can't boot
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17:41 < jrmu> I'm certain I had the correct command for rebuilding the array
17:41 < mischief> xse: excellent
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17:47 < jrmu> this really has been a nightmare for me
17:48 < sibiria> i personally don't recommend anyone to use raid 0/1/5 with openbsd's softraid
17:49 < sibiria> nor 1c
17:51 < k0ga> sibiria: do you recomend it for any other raid configuration?
17:52 < sibiria> the crypto discipline alone works well
17:53 < sibiria> it's the conventional raid levels using multiple disks that it has problems with, because it writes to disks in series instead of in parallel
17:54 < sibiria> every write operation is "open" for longer the more disks you have. performance drops almost linearly for every disk you add to the battery
17:54 < jrmu> performance I don't mind so much, it's the data loss that worries me
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17:57 < sibiria> somewhat ironically, the more disks you add to openbsd's softraid, the greater the chance for data corruption if a hiccup happens
18:00 < avemestr> I've used traditional hardware RAID with OpenBSD on top. Worked well. With the obvious known caveats fof hardware RAID of course.
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18:01 < jrmu> what command can help me check disk health with SMART? was it atactl?
18:01 < sibiria> yes, atactl
18:03 < mischief> a bit ot but anyone have rec's for a managed switch with 10g/2.5g copper and poe?
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18:08 < avemestr> Mikrotik is quite solid. Prefer their simple SwOS over RouterOS for switching. Have a look at CRS326-4C+20G+2Q+RM if you need 20*2.5GB + 4*10GB SFP+, and 2 40GB QSFP+ cages.
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18:10 < avemestr> For half the ports at 2/3 the price, there's CRS326-4C+20G+2Q+RM.
18:10 < jrmu> thanks sibiria 
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18:14 < lts> +1 for Mikrotik SwOS
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18:14 < mischief> that's a lot more switch than i need @_@
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18:16 < avemestr> mischief: How many ports do you need?
18:16 < mischief> <10
18:17 < mischief> today my 'switch' is a combination of QSW-2104-2T-R2 and the 6 ports that live in my odroid-h2+netcard openbsd router
18:18 < mischief> i only really need two 10g ports since its just my desktop and server that do 10g..
18:18 < mischief> technically my APs are 10g capable but i dont use wifi enough to care
18:20 < avemestr> The PoE... is that just to power the switch (PoE in) or also to power network devices (cameras, APs, etc)?
18:20 < mischief> there are potentially devices i'd like to power with poe, so the switch would be PSE
18:21 < mischief> i should probably just grab a dumb poe PSE switch from work for free instead of shelling out
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18:21 < mischief> (we make them but they aren't very nice)
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21:44 < independence> I did sysupgrade with a /usr partition of size 2.3G and now that partition is full and the upgrade can't continue, can I clean it up somehow?
21:44 -!- Red_ is now known as Red
21:44 < independence> it said in the release notes /usr must be at least 1.1G so I thought I should be fine, I don't have any ports stuff
21:45 < vortexx> independence: rm -rf /usr/share/relink and you should be good to go
21:45 < independence> can I continue the upgrade via the manual steps after?
21:47 < independence> or resume the sysupgrade somehow?
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21:51 < vortexx> just rerun sysupgrade
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21:57 < independence> hm after the upgrade it says it has the new release but some errors
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--- Log closed Wed Dec 10 00:00:59 2025