--- Log opened Tue May 19 00:00:33 2026
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00:20 < jetpackjackson> Ah
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00:20 < jetpackjackson> I'm surprised fish shell doesnt have more adoption in OpenBSD just based on the name alone :3
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00:30 < Bradipo> jetpackjackson: I used to be a bash user, until I started using OpenBSD.  Then I didn't really see a point in using bash anymore since ksh was just good enough.
00:30 < Bradipo> I'm not sure why I would switch to fish at this point...
00:31 < Bradipo> Looking at the "features"...
00:31 < Bradipo> "Reads Your Mind".  That's one thing that would annoy me.
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00:32 < Bradipo> "fish suggests commands as you type based on history and completions," <--- big time annoyance.
00:33 < Bradipo> But, for those who like such features, I have no problems with competition in the market for shells. :-)
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00:41 < thrig> yeah read about fish went nope nope nope
00:50 < jetpackjackson> Aw
00:52 < jetpackjackson> I need to figure out how to get ksh to show the autosuggestions like fish does
00:52 < jetpackjackson> Like
00:52 < jetpackjackson> Idk
00:53 < jetpackjackson> Maybe I should just dive into ksh again and use it like I did before
00:53 < jetpackjackson> Idk
00:53 < jetpackjackson> Sorry I'm yapping
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00:55 < oldlaptop> <Bradipo> "fish suggests commands as you type based on history and completions," <--- big time annoyance.
00:55 < oldlaptop> That was my first thought, but maaaaaaaybe it's not as utterly infuriating as GUI editors? If all it does is show this super-low-contrast version of what it would tab-complete, it's probably not *that* evil? https://fishshell.com/assets/img/screenshots/autosuggestion.webp
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00:59 < oldlaptop> the "make the most important words less visible" feature seems harmful, though. https://fishshell.com/assets/img/screenshots/works_out_of_the_box.webp
01:00 < Bradipo> oldlaptop: PowerShell does the same thing, it's super annoying.
01:00 < oldlaptop> (but the persistent popularity of "transparent" terminals suggests that being able to read things isn't universally considered an important feature)
01:01 < Bradipo> But, to those who like that, more power too them.
01:01 < pardis> in the last couple of days we've had multiple people in this channel alone describe the error message as "something like unexpected something", or that sort of thing
01:01 < pardis> so yes, not all users prioritise reading things
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01:30 < vaskas> Hi guys. I would love some insight: I have mirrored packages and packages-stable to my hard drive, changed the installurl to point to the base OpenBSD directory. Now when I run pkg_add it looks in packages-stable/, ignoring the packages/. Is this the right behaviour? I thought it should somehow merge the two sets.
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01:31 < Bradipo> I believe that is correct behavior.  If there exists a packages-stable it prefers that.
01:32 < vaskas> In my case it doesn't even look into packages/. E.g. I have qpdfview in packages/ but not in packages-stable/. If I try to pkg_add qpdfview, it says it can't find it
01:32 < Bradipo> Oh, hmm.
01:33 < Bradipo> https://man.openbsd.org/pkg_add discusses a bit about how paths are searched.
01:33 < Bradipo> But it doesn't seem to suggest a preference.
01:33 < jetpackjackson> Maybe I'll See if I can get used to ksh
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01:34 < Bradipo> jetpackjackson: If you like fish, use it.
01:35 < Bradipo> Just don't make it your "root" shell.
01:35 < oldlaptop> (Nobodu'
01:35 < oldlaptop> *Nobody will stop you if you *do* make it your root shell. It's just a mildly effective way to cause weeping and gnashing of teeth for yourself.
01:36 < pardis> and if you change your root shell and then complain later that you can't recover a broken system, someone is likely to laugh at you
01:36 < oldlaptop> reports of grue predation are unconfirmed
01:38 < oldlaptop> vaskas: What exactly is in this installurl file?
01:39 < vaskas> Bradipo thanks. It does indeed say: 'then a second directory is also searched, which is constructed by replacing "packages" with "packages-stable"'.
01:39 < oldlaptop> (And what is your working directory?)
01:41 < vaskas> oldlaptop: the installurl is a local path: /storage/media/OpenBSD. Which contains 7.8/{packages,packages-stable}. Any working directory gives the same result.
01:42  * oldlaptop would not be shocked to learn that scheme-less and/or file:// installurls do not work as hoped
01:42 < oldlaptop> well, not and/or, just or
01:42 < jetpackjackson> Right but shouldn't I also try to learn the defaults? I mean they're there for a reason
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01:43 < jetpackjackson> And it seems like people like it
01:43 < oldlaptop> You'll not have a very good time using and administering unix systems if you're utterly lost with a Bourne-oid shell. (Just as you'll probably have a bad time if you can't at least quit vi.)
01:44 < jetpackjackson> Fair
01:44 < oldlaptop> Beyond that point, it is your computer to use as you wish, and your brain to fill with knowledge as you wish.
01:45 < jetpackjackson> True
01:46 < oldlaptop> Perhaps someone would laugh at you for using fish, or nano, or driving $cheap_car_brand - I'd guess #openbsd is disproportionately populated by people who don't care about that kind of thing
01:46 < jetpackjackson> Maybe I can do a comparison to see if I'm faster using ksh to type, like maybe the tab completion and suggestions make me pause idj
01:46 < vaskas> oldlaptop you are spot on. I've just spawned an http server and changed my installurl to a http://127.0.0.1 type address and it now looks in both packages/ and packages-stable/. Wow.
01:46 < vaskas> file:// didn't work either
01:47 < jetpackjackson> oldlaptop: fair. Although I will say nano is nice as a basic editor for strange computers
01:47 < oldlaptop> It is plausible nobody has thought to try this idea before.
01:47 < oldlaptop> nano is a suitable mg(1) substitute where mg(1) is not yet installed
01:48 < jetpackjackson> Mg is the mini emacs right?
01:48 < jetpackjackson> I used to use emacs but switched to helix
01:48 < jetpackjackson> I only use emacs now for XMPP chats lmao
01:48 < oldlaptop> I believe the name was "Micro GNU Emacs" or something to that effect at one time. (The makers of GNU Emacs then objected for the obvious reasons)
01:49 < oldlaptop> that "one time" may well have been before OpenBSD started
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01:49 < vaskas> oldlaptop quite possible. Thank you for the pointer. I'll see if I can file a fix.
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01:51 < oldlaptop> https://cvsweb.openbsd.org/checkout/src/usr.bin/mg/README,v?rev=1.14 (note that OpenBSD's cvs repository began in late 1995)
01:51 < jetpackjackson> oldlaptop: interesting
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05:18 < martian67> Interestingly linus uses a different fork of mg
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05:20 < rIMpossible> G'morning :) seven-Ohhhh-nine day
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05:22 < rIMpossible> 7:09 AM MDT (Mountain Daylight Time) is 3:09 PM in CEST (Central European Summer Time). I have still to wait in my TZ ;)
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05:39 < thrig> waitpid is timezone independent
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06:02 < rIMpossible> Just saying w/o actually saying it ;)
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08:12 < Posterdati> hi 
08:12 < Posterdati> please how can I fix dovecto problem: failed: Cached message size larger than expected 
08:12 < Posterdati> thanks!
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08:15 < IcePic> google the error message to see what others did to solve it? https://community.mailcow.email/d/3596-dovecot-cached-message-size-larger-than-expected
08:16 < cgnarne> ^---
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08:16 < IcePic> https://forum.directadmin.com/threads/webmail-error-failed-cached-message-size-larger-than-expected.72365/ in case the emails have been compressed or uncompressed
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08:29 < cve> o/
08:31 < cve> is there a reason why I would want to use pass/block for binat-to instead of match?
08:32 < rIMpossible> Just for my own interest: How long does it take, to mirror all mirror-servers if a release is approved by TdR and no further changes for release are necessary?
08:33 < rIMpossible> IMHO I would guess, between 2 and 3 weeks. But prove me wrong ;)
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09:41 < avemestr> rIMpossible: Virtually impossible to say. A lot of the mirrors are run by more or less volunteers.
09:46 < avemestr> rIMpossible: E.g. the mirror closest to me did not have sufficient space, so patches were not mirrorred there for a while. I mentioned it to them, and they fixed it within a couple of weeks. But nothing OpenBSD devs could do anything about.
09:47 < lts> Is cdn.openbsd.org also run by volunteers?
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09:50 < cgnarne> nah, that's cloudflare or smth
09:50 < avemestr> It's a cdn run by fastly.
09:50 < mischief> lts: fastly innit
09:50 < avemestr> But: https://www.reddit.com/r/openbsd/comments/1mewuc1/is_the_fastly_cdn_down/ 
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09:52 < avemestr> I'm pretty sure Stuart Henderson (_sthen in that thread) knows what he's talking about :-)
09:53 < cgnarne> i've had no problems with cdn in germany
09:53 < avemestr> Both dotsrc.org and spline.de has been friendly and fast to fix the mirror, when I've mentioned problems to them.
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09:55 < mischief> UCB mirror has worked great for me, very fast
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09:58 < lts> So the CDN local nodes don't actually contain the data unless it's been previously/recently fetched and cached by someone else
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10:03 < avemestr> From a hetzner-hosted machine (in Germany): Fetching from cdn.openbsd.org approx. 8MB/s. Fetching from spline.de approx. 80MB/s. Over HTTPS in both cases.
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10:11 < rIMpossible> fau.de is a university driven ftp (Friedrich Alexander Universitaet). Mostly the fastest in Germany
10:13 < rIMpossible> Once I read the update times, who is admin and where it is exactly located. I don't find that site back ....
10:14 < lts> https://www.openbsd.org/build/mirrors.dat ?
10:15 < lts> Or https://spacehopper.org/mirmon/
10:17 < IcePic> rIMpossible: I think it takes a few days at most. Snaps are replaced almost daily for some 3-4 arches, and packages is what takes most time and space, so when you have those, install-bins for m88k and macppc isn't noticeable in time to sync
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10:25 < rIMpossible> IcePic: Ok, I didn't think, that's it is so fast. Considering not everyone who offers mirroring has a 155 Gbit/s connection
10:26 < rIMpossible> I don't know how much a whole release set takes for all packages and the base
10:27 < rIMpossible> ... for all the different architectures
10:30 < lts> I'll rather take the slow mirror which I'm sure will have the latest updates, than a fast mirror which doesn't
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10:32 < lts> "mean mirror age is 10.1 days, std_dev 35.3 days, median 14 hours"
10:32 < lts> (from the spacehopper link above)
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10:33 < rIMpossible> lts: thanks for the list. The first mentioned, it was :)
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10:36 < IcePic> rIMpossible: some 400+ GB
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10:36 < IcePic> 7.9 is 308GB now, packages_stable will add some 100 as time goes on I guess
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10:38 < mischief> IcePic: you run one of the mirrors no?
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10:41 < IcePic> mischief: yes, ftp.eu.*
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10:46 < rIMpossible> IcePic: N/ER ?
10:47 < IcePic> rIMpossible: ?
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10:48 < rIMpossible> IcePic: I thought you are at FAU
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10:52 < IcePic> Nopes, I started mirroring obsd stuff at su.se, then moved on but the mirror stayed, then it was set to be dismantled there, so I moved it to hw located in Norway
10:52 < IcePic> so .se and .no
10:55 < avemestr> rIMpossible: https://ftp.fau.de/about.html perhaps?
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11:02 < rIMpossible> IcePic: Ah, I see. Back in the 90's I was a lot on scandinavian BBS's and servers. The AMIGA scene in Germany was always in big friendship with scandinavia and benelux
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11:05 < rIMpossible> avemestr: thank you. Nice hardware they have .... In the stats we are still under the radar, so means good https://blogs.fau.de/ftp/
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11:10 < citbl> I haven't looked at openbsd for about 22 years but the impeding 60th release really has me on the edge of the seat, visiting the site twice a day... 
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11:11 < citbl> I have a second hand thinkpad ready to go!
11:11 < lts> AFAIK the release is on the mirrors already, it's just the announcement that's missing
11:13 < rIMpossible> Historically, one should be patient enough, to wait with the installation, until it is honourously announced on openbsd.org ;p
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11:13 < rIMpossible> lts: not all mirrors are yet sync'ed
11:14 < rIMpossible> And: it is 7:09 MDT as official release time ;)
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11:15 < lts> Soo.. two hours or so? :-)
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11:16 < rIMpossible> I don't know your timezone :p
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11:16 < lts> o_O
11:17 < citbl> oh wow I didn't know that
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11:17 < lts> I really hope my timezone doesn't change how far in the future 7:09 MDT will be :-P
11:17 < citbl> if I were to purchase a hoodie, is the design of 59th going to disappear in a jif or there are few days for which I can decide to wait for 60th's design?
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11:36 < mischief> IcePic: how much traffic does the mirror sustain?
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12:05 < IcePic> mischief: I haven't checked in a while, but since a lot of other eu mirrors (and possibly home users) rsync from it, it is a lot. Glad to be on research network for that
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12:41 < jetpackjackson> i think today im gonna see if i can patch jj-fzf to work on openbsd
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12:57 < jetpackjackson> oh cool it was just a change to mktemp
12:57 < jetpackjackson> and installing bash and gsed and fzf
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13:14 < tylerius> \o/ 
13:15 < tylerius> cool artwork!
13:15 < phy1729> rIMpossible: the release time just matches the release number
13:15 < polarian> 7.9 IS DROPPED!!!
13:15 < polarian> I DIDNT EVEN REALISE
13:16 < jetpackjackson> oh i was on snapshots
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13:16 < ssm_> o shti
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13:18 < rIMpossible> And it was 3:09pm CEST, so 7:09 MDT, even though it matches the version number, it matched also the release time :p
13:23 < lts> Yayy
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13:25 < polarian> question is, do I syspatch my router and risk it failing right now himmmmmmmm
13:25 < polarian> idk
13:25 < rIMpossible> A big thank you to the developers for that awesome new piece of Release. *clap*
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13:25 < lts> "Verify that the /usr partition has a size of at least 1.1G" I wonder when this will be changed :-D 
13:26 < rIMpossible> polarian: Every three releases, I do a complete new installation, not just sysupgrade
13:26 < polarian> rIMpossible: thats cool!
13:26 < polarian> I should do something similar
13:26 < polarian> but quite frankly I have no time to 
13:26 < polarian> aint no rest for the wicked 
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13:27 < jetpackjackson> lts: speaking of that, why does the default install do so many little partitions if it causes issues?
13:27 < rIMpossible> lts: I read in the changelog, that it has been worked on that issue
13:28 < ssm_> jetpackjackson: what do you mean, we only have 1 slice by default on mbr/gpt :)
13:28 < jetpackjackson> lol
13:28 < jetpackjackson> i mean like
13:28 < polarian> wasnt there rumours of IPv6 nexthop being supported in 7.9
13:28 < polarian> or am I wrong?
13:29 < jetpackjackson> huh weird how do i have 30gb unused on my qemu vm?
13:29 < jetpackjackson> lemme find a pastebin
13:29 < tommyrot> different partitions have different mount options which can have stricter behaviour, increasing security
13:30 < tommyrot> and if your drive is too small to accommodate these many partitions the installers falls back to less partitions
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13:31 < jetpackjackson> https://termbin.com/v90r
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13:33 < nerfur> I'm presenting to you unofficial release 7.9 song! https://openbsd.org.ru/unsong79.html
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13:35 < polarian> lol
13:35 < polarian> is it in Russian
13:36 < jetpackjackson> do i need to reinstall
13:36 < jetpackjackson> to use my full disk
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13:38 < rIMpossible> Here is the official 7.9 song https://www.openbsd.org/lyrics.html#79
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13:39 < miah> i want a new shirt with the 7.9 art
13:39 < moviuro> I want a new tshirt with the 6.6 art :|
13:40 < polarian> ayyy theres a new song 
13:40 < polarian> I wanna hear it
13:40 < miah> it would be cool if we could buy shirts with historic art
13:40 < polarian> 7.9 cd OwO
13:40 < polarian> miah: you can, from other BSD members
13:40 < polarian> might be costly
13:40 < miah> indeed
13:40 < polarian> you can still get the 7.8 design 
13:40 < polarian> so if you want it, I would order it quickly 
13:40 < miah> ya i might order it today
13:40 < miah> i really like the 7.7 shirt i got
13:40 < miah> love the unix surrealism
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13:41 < miah> i live in the middle of nowhere, small town, people always ask me about it
13:41 < jetpackjackson> how can i find out what package on my system installed tmux into /usr/bin
13:42 < jetpackjackson> tried pkg_info -E /usr/bin/tmux but got nothing
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13:43 < moviuro> jetpackjackson: https://github.com/openbsd/src/tree/master/usr.bin/tmux <- tmux is included in OpenBSD
13:43 < jetpackjackson> oh!
13:43 < jetpackjackson> cool!
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13:44 < rIMpossible> miah: I liked the one with the green corona-virus, people in Brussels reacted somehow shocked :)))
13:44 < miah> lol nice
13:45 < miah> ok 7.8 shirt on its way, now to wait for the site to get updated for 7.9 =)
13:45 < jetpackjackson> man now i want a bsd shirt lol
13:45 < nerfur> rIMpossible: it is totally dance day! :D
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13:45 < nerfur> polarian: page - yes, song - not
13:45 < polarian> jetpackjackson: you didnt know tmux is a OpenBSD project?
13:46 < polarian> lol
13:46 < jetpackjackson> no i didnt lol
13:46 < polarian> obviously all good software is OpenBSD :p
13:46 < polarian> pf, made by OpenBSD
13:46 < polarian> opensmtpd? 
13:46 < polarian> same
13:46 < polarian> openbgpd?
13:46 < polarian> httpd (openbsd)?
13:46 < polarian> yep yep yep
13:47 < polarian> openssh how could I forgot
13:47 < polarian> also OpenBSD 
13:47 < miah> also, openssh =)
13:47 < nerfur> and dont even begin how many important software maintanied by devs or ex-devs of OpenBSD, even screen 
13:47 < polarian> every system on the planet likely has a line of OpenBSD code in it :3
13:47 < miah> so thankful i dont have to install ssleay and ssh anymore
13:49 < jetpackjackson> oh wow
13:49 < jetpackjackson> cool
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13:49 < miah> i guess we could add LibreSSL to that list polarian
13:49 < polarian> oh right yeah 
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13:50 < miah> got my first sysupgrade done: OpenBSD orange.lan 7.9
13:50  * oldlaptop has gotten more comments about the 7.0 shirt than anything else, generally missing that it's not actually the painting it looks like
13:50 < miah> cpu0: AMD E-350 Processor, 1600.07 MHz all that power!
13:51 < oldlaptop> not entirely unlike an apu2 :)
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13:53 < miah> my little raid5 music box
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13:53 < jetpackjackson> is my storage space ok on my vm?
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13:55 < miah> looks a little tight. you could format that unused 30g and mount it somewhere
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13:55 < Posterdati> is out!
13:55 < Posterdati> Hurra
13:56 < lts> Congratulations
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13:57 < jetpackjackson> i just dont know why it didnt use all the space
13:59 < miah> when you did the install you didnt tell it to use your entire disk
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14:00 < miah> wonder if it will take 6 months to get my 7.8 shirt. (it took 5 to get my 7.7)
14:02 < Posterdati> thanks to Theo de Raadt and his coworkers :)
14:02 < Posterdati> keep up to do the good work!
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14:05 < lts> Alright, that postgresql update did _not_ go well. Time to restore from backups and try again with better time
14:06 -!- roesyyu [~zorone@user/zorone] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded]
14:06 < lts> (Or maybe with the dump and restore method)
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14:17 < leah2> the title here is wrong, right? Changes made between OpenBSD 7.7 and 7.8:
14:17 < leah2> https://www.openbsd.org/plus79.html
14:17 < gipa> lts: can you share more details? did you follow the upgrade79 guide?
14:17 < leah2> sorry. it should say "7.8 and 7.9"?
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14:20 < cli> 79 HYPE
14:20 < ssm_> 67 and 69 were already done, so naturally 79 remains
14:21 < ssm_> see you 97
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14:23 < lts> gipa: I think my failure was that I didn't understand "${PREV_MAJOR}" would need to be changed by me. :-D
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14:31 < gipa> lts: i also have some postgresql that needs to be ugpraded and that version bump in the changelog always looks scary to me
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14:40 < mischief> ok, time to upgrade ye olde router i suppose
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14:44 < rIMpossible> The t-shirts in the shop are now AVAILABLE *clap* https://openbsd.creator-spring.com/
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14:45 < lts> So beautiful
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15:14 < mischief2> great success
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15:28 < cjs> spectacular artwork for 7.9-release :)
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15:28 < cjs> Pink Panther, right?
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15:31 < rIMpossible>  /bsd.upgrade is not u+x - it is with a 0 byte file in /var/tftpboot. I did it only once. Is it ok to leave it like this and going on or what to do?
15:31 < rIMpossible> perms are 755
15:33 < lts> gipa: finally got it with method one. Had to increase semaphores (sysctl kern.seminfo.semmns=2048) and also when setting "local all postgres trust" to pg_hba.conf, it needs to be the _first_ item. I think with these the method two would have worked as well
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15:44 < gipa> lts: glad it worked and ty for sharing ;)
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15:52 < moviuro> Sorry, but 16€ shipping & handling on a 35€ tshirt is outrageous. 35€ was the full price I paid in 2024, what happened since then?..
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16:03 < vxla> capitalism happened
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16:06 < moviuro> 30€ tee + 5€ s&h in 2024. tee +16%; s&h +220%
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16:09 < oldlaptop> international shipping might be a little more exciting generally
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16:14 < moviuro> same shop, same home address
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16:20 < thrig> tee meanwhile ships free with openbsd
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16:21 < lts> cat also
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16:26 < JetpackJackson> ok i got znc working again
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16:43 < JetpackJackson> ok something im noticing with ksh, doing long commands is kind of a pain compared to fish, whether its in history or not. how do yall work around that or fix it?
16:45 < thrig> kind of a pain how?
16:46 < anthk_> congrat for the new release
16:46 < JetpackJackson> like i was trying to rsync some stuff and it was a struggle to remember the commands when in fish i could hve just typed part of it and then right arrow and then it would be there
16:47 < thrig> dunno, I have HISTSIZE=32 and "unset HISTFILE" set
16:48 < rcf> JetpackJackson: oh, so you mean the completion
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16:49 < thrig> if it's something complicated I'll put it into a script or program given the lack of a shell history with random flailings
16:49 < metavoid> you can install fish if you need it
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16:50 < ivdsangen> ctrl-r helps a bit maybe?
16:51 < rcf> JetpackJackson: you can define some basic completions for ksh, but I don't think it's quite as fancy as what you're used to.
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16:59 < polarian> is there an easy way to figure out what serial interface a device is using 
17:00 < polarian> dmesg doesnt tell you this, so its trail and error until you find which interface 
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17:00 < polarian> or just knowing that a usb serial device will be /dev/cuaUx x starting from 0
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17:06 < oldlaptop> JetpackJackson: Probably most of us are either more used to committing that kind of thing to memory, or would pull up the manual. rsync is a troublesome case given the sheer number of options.
17:08 < oldlaptop> https://xkcd.com/1168/ may not ring quite true, but rsync or curl...
17:08 < polarian> hah
17:08 < polarian> this is very true
17:09 < polarian> the number of times you think "is it -R or -r" 
17:12 < IcePic> polarian: if it attaches as com0 at usb-something, then it is /dev/cuaU0 
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17:13 < IcePic> polarian: if you add a usb-serial, the /dev/cuaUx would be touched and show up far down if you "ls -latr /dev" right after plugging in
17:13 < polarian> ahhh
17:13 < polarian> thx for the tips IcePic `
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17:14 < polarian> I dont know why OpenBSD keeps all the devs created when nothing is attached to them 
17:14 < polarian> on other operating systems a dev only exists if its in use
17:14 < IcePic> polarian: because it doesn't have a devfs ramdisk thingy with udevd to autocreate them
17:14 < renaud> it used to be like this on linux too, they made it dynamic afterwards
17:15 < ssm_> dbus package wants libexpat 17.1 even though after updating to 7.9 my expat is 17.0. I'm building from source, this happen to anyone else?
17:15 < cgnarne> devfs and the like are not worth the complexity
17:15 < renaud> and devfs brings all other kinds of issues
17:15 < cgnarne> ssm_: you building ports from current?
17:15 < ssm_> I'm gonna read the 9p source code >:)
17:16 < ssm_> cgnarne: no, this was a pkg_add -u after upgrading to 7.9 from a february snapshot
17:16 < polarian> IcePic: ahhh
17:16 < polarian> interesting 
17:16 < polarian> I guess that makes the os much more simple 
17:17 < polarian> also IcePic you coming to EuroBSDCon this year?
17:17 < IcePic> polarian: yes
17:17 < polarian> cool
17:17 < polarian> cya in Brussels ig 
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17:17 < IcePic> polarian: I'd be happy to meet you once more
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17:20 < IcePic> ssm_: libexpat 17.{0,1} comes with the x11, so it feels like you are building current ports on a not-current machine?
17:21 < ssm_> I'm installing from pkg_add. maybe it's possible pkg_add was pulling from current repos
17:21 < ssm_> yup PKG_PATH=https://cdn.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/snapshots/packages/%a/
17:22 < ssm_> was in my /etc/shell.rc and forgot about it
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17:26 < ssm_> I set that to avoid typing -Dsnap near updates
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17:27 < cgnarne> aha, there you fo
17:28 < cgnarne> s/fo/go/
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17:35 < JetpackJackson> oldlaptop: ah fair
17:35 < JetpackJackson> i think i might just use fish again. idk. i used to be able to switch from fish to ksh, dunno what changed in my brain
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17:36 < npm> hi folks, found a mid 2012 macbook pro on sale for $50 around, and I plan to make it my main openbsd machine
17:36 < npm> would it be old enough to have drivers for all the bits and bobs inside?
17:37 < oldlaptop> I don't recall whether macbooks around that time had NVIDIA GPUs or not.
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17:37 < oldlaptop> If so, that's not going to be old enough to be "supported" by nv(4).
17:37 < npm> doesn't
17:38 < wolfdog> i don't see why not then
17:38 < npm> have the spec on hand, hd graphics 4000
17:38 < npm> wolfdog: sweet, thanks
17:38 < npm> including built in keyboard and trackpad and such?
17:38 < oldlaptop> The next thing I'd wonder about is wifi.
17:39 < npm> i wouldn't be opposed to cracking it open and putting in a supported wifi card
17:40 < renaud> today is my kernel panic day
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17:40 < npm> doesn't look like there's a driver for airport cards, sucks
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17:41 < cgnarne> just give it a try. find out what works
17:41 < npm> that's the plan
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17:42 < JetpackJackson> i feel like i should make my username lowercase 
17:47 < JetpackJackson> how long do the shirts stay in the store for?
17:51 < cjs> JetpackJackson: The OpenBSD storefront carries the artwork of a particular -release from the moment of that -release until the subsequent -release, so approximately 6 months
17:52 < cjs> They are printed on demand, so it is not a depleting inventory or some such thing
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17:52 < JetpackJackson> oh ok cool
17:52 < cjs> Anything that you might read about the importance of ordering the -release shirt and CD on -release day in a Web forum would be from a bygone era. OpenBSD has used this print-on-demand service for years now.
17:53 < JetpackJackson> i just noticed the order on the artwork page is 7.8 -> 7.9 -> 7.7
17:54 < oldlaptop> (and last printed CDs at all years ago)
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17:54 < oldlaptop> (pressed, rather? I guess you print the labels too.)
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17:55 < cjs> The flip side of the on-demand service is that while there is not any worry about running out of stock, even in greater Houston (a major metro) with domestic (USA) printing and shipping, the last time that I ordered something it took several weeks, if not 6(?) or so, to arrive.
17:56 < cjs> pros and cons and all that
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17:56 < oldlaptop> It used to be less absurd :|
17:56 < oldlaptop> (or at least I don't remember earlier shirts taking months on end)
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17:57 < JetpackJackson> gotcha
17:57 < JetpackJackson> ok
17:57 < JetpackJackson> good to know, thanks
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18:00 < vortexx> Happy release day!
18:03 < JetpackJackson> :D
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18:06 < JetpackJackson> https://termbin.com/cq4i the virtual disk will resize, right? i just realized that
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18:21 < JetpackJackson> is the wifi on the raspberry pi 3B supported out of the box?
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18:33 < mischief> JetpackJackson: it should be bwfm(4) driver.
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18:36 < JetpackJackson> ok cool beans
18:37 < JetpackJackson> is there a way to configure the wifi when flashing or do i need a keyboard and monitor to set up the wifi connection for the first boot
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18:39 < mischief> flashing? this isn't raspberry pi os. you'll likely want to run the installer, either via glass console or serial line
18:39 < mischief> see INSTALL.arm64 on your local openbsd mirror
18:42 < JetpackJackson> oh ok
18:43 < JetpackJackson> i uh dont have serial, is hdmi ok
18:43 < JetpackJackson> wait lemme read the friendly manual first
18:46 < JetpackJackson> ok i guess i will need to connect to the keyboard
18:47 < JetpackJackson> is my only option writing the install image to the sd card
18:47 < JetpackJackson> instead of a usb stick
18:50 < mischief> no clue, i don't have one
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18:53 < sandmanXpuff> i made a kids computer with openbsd, just dosbox and scummvm :-)
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18:55 < JetpackJackson> sandmanXpuff: nice!
18:57 < JetpackJackson> mischief: aw ok
18:57 < JetpackJackson> do you know anyone here who does?
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18:57 < JetpackJackson> i only have one SD card now and one usb stick that i use for iso files so i dont want to erase my server and stick until im sure it will work
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19:02 < mischief> JetpackJackson: time to visit $local_computer_shop
19:02 < mischief> sd cards are stupid cheap these days
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19:07 < sandmanXpuff> yeah, i've found if u got a sbc without sdcard only, disable all the logging and what not
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19:19 < JetpackJackson> mischief: fair
19:19 < JetpackJackson> ill look around some more first
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19:59 < elarks> 7.9 lets go!
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20:01 < thrig> I'll wait for service pack 3 or so
20:02 < cli> Wdym SP3
20:02 < cli> I'm still on ME
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20:27 < polarian> spekul isn't here :/
20:27 < polarian> oops wrong channel
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20:27 < polarian> always mixing up freebsd and openbsd :3
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20:30 < JetpackJackson> lol
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21:23 < rIMpossible> What is best practice to completely install a system from scratch, when you have a broken eth, but a working wifi card and want to install the firmware drivers, before it actually tries to get network information?
21:24 < rIMpossible> Ahhhh and not to forget, you install with FDE by passphrase 
21:24 < thrig> some folks like their life more complicated
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21:26 < rIMpossible> thrig: even though I did not configure the network during install. using FDE blocked somehow the stick, so it could not install the sets.
21:27 < cgnarne> use a cheap usb ethernet
21:29 < rIMpossible> I got it installed without a cheap usb ethernet
21:29 < rIMpossible> It just took me triple the time
21:30 < cgnarne> triple the time, triple the fun
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21:49 < cli> Any chance that OpenBSD merch distribution will outgrow teespring?
21:49 < cli> Ever?
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21:50 < cli> So many people have had trouble with them in the past.
21:50 < cli> What mailing list is the correct one to whine on?
21:51 < cli> man merch
21:51 < cli> man: No entry for merch in the manual.
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22:05 < mischief> my 7.8 shirt was from there and i just ordered my 7.9 earlier. didn't have an issue.
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22:06 < mischief> though i'd rather full cotton shirts... idk if i believe this lie about recycled polyester
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22:06 < deimosBSD> cli: i just had a local shop embroider Puffy onto an Oxford shirt, since I can't wear t-shirts professionally.
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22:27 < adonis> when doing a restore from a dump of a filesystem /usr which contains X11R6, how do I restore such that the extracted folders don't contain the top directory X11R6? I simply want the files and folders in the dump to be extracted without their parent folder.
22:27 < adonis> by restore I mean restore -i
22:28 < adonis> I want to restore the contents of X11R6 without X11R6 itself.
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--- Log closed Wed May 20 00:00:35 2026