--- Log opened Tue Aug 18 00:00:26 2026
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00:14 < fro> https://briancallahan.net/blog/20260811.html
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13:41 < ssm_> AMOGUS
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14:07 < ssm_> is www/yt-dlp on its last legs
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14:08 < ssm_> I'm on -current and I've been getting 403's after a few seconds of successful fetching both through no proxy and tor
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14:08 < ssm_> should probably check if I'm behind cgnat
14:08 < miah> google and yt-dlp are always in a cat & mouse race
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14:08 < phy1729> You could see if yt-dlp has an update yet and bump the port
14:08 < ssm_> yeah, I've done that a few times
14:08 < miah> it'll work, then it will break, they'll fix it, google will break it, repeat
14:08 < ssm_> though I never notified the list, I just did a local bump
14:09 < ssm_> thing is I never know if it's deno or yt-dlp now :S
14:09 < ssm_> is google telling me to stop slacking and start hacking?
14:09 < miah> always
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14:11 < sibiria> bumping the port is the first step, but getting someone in "management" to push it to the build server is the real battle
14:12 < phy1729> Eh, the bumps are usually small and easy to get ok'd
14:13 < sibiria> tons of ports getting no stable update because nobody can be bothered or doesn't consider it important enough even if it affects functionality
14:13 < sibiria> the natural result of the process being ad-hoc rather than systemic
14:14 < phy1729> Although 2026.07.04 is still the latest release
14:15 < ssm_> https://github.com/yt-dlp/yt-dlp/issues/17456 seems well known
14:15 < ssm_> nothing on our end to do
14:17 < boplaid> it is in nightly
14:18 < boplaid> yt-dlp will probably trigger a stable release since both youtube and tiktok are broken on stable
14:23 < ssm_> viva la peer tube etc etc
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14:46 < ssm_> okay I updated it, have a patch http://howdoesmycode.work/tmp/yt-dlp-2026.08.18.122307.diff
14:48 < ssm_> don't send to lists, this is yt-dlp-nightly-releases
14:48 < rcf> The stable yt-dlp has always been on its last legs 
14:49 < vortexx> I actually know the guy behind peertube.ch and fairsocialnet.ch, I met him at a local linux meet up
14:49 < rcf> Or at least ever since YouTube really declared war on third-party applications
14:50 < boplaid> my guess as to why stable even exists is that it's for people who'd rather not update much
14:50 < ssm_> relic of better times? :)
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14:53 < sibiria> you cannot be "stable" without updating regularly. regular updates is what -stable is about. or irregular, as it were...
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14:58 < ssm_> could add a www/yt-dlp-nightly-builds to ports@ and mark with PERMIT_PACKAGE = not for -stable/-release
14:58 < ssm_> or however this type of selector is made
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15:01 < rcf> sibiria: stable in the upstream sense, not the OpenBSD sense
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15:06 < rcf> Their stable is just old, and therefore extremely broken after often only a few days given the nature of what they do.
15:07 < rcf> (I'm pretty sure Google keep a few breaking changes in the pipeline to deploy immediately after a yt-dlp release)
15:08 < RobbieAB> Pretty sure that in this era of AI coding tools, that is a loosing proposition, even for Google.
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15:25 < sonya> ssm_: $ pipx upgrade yt-dlp   →  if current yt is needed.. imho..
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15:32  * TommyC has always used pip for yt-dlp too
15:32 < TommyC> But in a virtualenv
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16:11 < ssm_> sonya: bumping port easier qed
16:12 < ssm_> I already maintain a bunch of ports (mostly unofficial) so it's not like I'm adding anything significant to my load
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16:20 < broke> Hello, I already asked this on misc@ but I really didn't get any good answers other than having DontZap and DontVTSwitch in Xorg, which is for startx(1) and perhaps a VT switch while my screen is being locked using xlock(1)? I am not sure what either ones helps anywhere anyways, and next one denying the use of sleep and recommending hibernation instead. But hibernation is too slow for me to consider its 
16:20 < broke> usability on the go. Here's the original question:
16:20 < broke> https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-misc&m=178704324548757&w=2
16:20 < broke> (About Laptop security on the go)
16:21 < broke> (also, its /etc/apm/suspend instead of resume)
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17:06 < sonya> broke: ymmv, i started with per-file encryption and ended with a special encrypted partition/disklabel to store sensitive data. i also rejected the idea of hybernation and even set vm.swapencrypt.enable=0 .. all i do is 'sync' and umount encrypted partition when not needed.. and mount back if in need.. i don't have records in 'fstab' and keep the pass in my memory.. also i don't think that this is
17:06 < sonya> "perfect" way - it suits my needs and that's all.. 
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17:26 < broke> I also thought recently that while on top of ffs already being slow, and using FDE on top is a serious hit on performance as well, so I had considered that for some time. I also do not like the idea of hibernation at all because its a waste of your SSD writes. I might end up using your method in the future anyways (In a future reinstall)
17:27 < broke> I have a HP S700 running at 3 Gb/s Sata II speeds, and all I get is around mere 20 mbps, this is not really a joke honestly :(
17:27 < broke> 20 mb/s*
17:28 < broke> (MB/s*)
17:31 < sibiria> 20 mb/s directly on SATA port?
17:32 < sibiria> unusually slow
17:32 < sonya> broke: there's also a thing to keep in mind: your ssd controller treat all encrypted partitions/disklabels/files/etc as a chunk of data.. no gc (garbage collection) as a result.. and this leads to a (huge) overprovisioning.. and hopes to the best :))
17:32 < broke> sibiria: directly, yes, its a sata II port.
17:33 < broke> I also thought that was unusually slow, but people here said it was likely because of the FDE.
17:33 < sibiria> super slow computer?
17:33 < sibiria> stuck on lowest CPU speed?
17:33 < vortexx> Haven't heard of FDE slowing disk access down that much
17:34 < sibiria> it really takes a big bite
17:34 < broke> sibiria: I don't think my computer is super slow at all XD
17:34 < broke> It is a thinkpad x201
17:34 < broke> It has an Arrandale CPU iirc
17:34 < sibiria> broke: i asked about "directly on SATA port" because those speeds sounded like USB2 speeds, but the problem is obviously the x201 :)
17:34 < broke> i5 1st gen
17:35 < sibiria> ok; the problem really is openbsd's FDE and FFS, but...
17:35 < sibiria> oh wasn't x201 in the core 2 era?
17:35 < broke> nope
17:35 < broke> it was the 1st gen i5
17:36 < broke> kind of 80% performant to a X230
17:36 < broke> Well, I have doubts its the x201, but I have never done benchmarks on Linux on this machine
17:37 < sibiria> if it's an i3/i5 it's "fast enough" for sure
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17:39 < broke> well, I will get a Linux SSD on this machine to do some benchmarks soon, but I think its still FFS and FDE to blame for the 20 MB/s R/W speed.
17:39 < broke> sorry not blame, but I'm not sure
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17:41 < sibiria> my slow-ish router/gw gets about 130-140 mb/s over NVMe. with FDE on the very same device, that performance drops with some 30% or so
17:41 < sibiria> it is abyssmal
17:42 < broke> Well, I will come back after testing more with Linux (on another SSD) and update on this. (1. Linux, Linux with FDE, OpenBSD without FDE to compare).
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17:49  * Ove_ doesnt need disk encryption
17:49 < Ove_> Because I use a secure operating system
17:50 < zcram> they say encryption is good for stolen laptops
17:50 < broke> zcram: unless you do something sophisticated like what sonya mentioned earlier
17:50 < broke> which works too and is smart as heck.
17:51 < broke> you are suffering from encrypting your entire disk for the sake of security of a few files in some places.
17:53 < sibiria> two different things. one is to protect just your sensitive the data. the other is to protect your OS from immediate manipulation
17:53 < sibiria> sensitive data*
17:54 < broke> if the "immediate manipulation" came from the stolen laptop I get back, I wouldn't trust anything on that disk to begin with.
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17:55 < broke> (trust the OS in the disk)
17:55 < ivdsangen> manipulation of the OS is one thing, manipulation of the hardware is another that you have to worry about if you worry about OS manipulation
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17:55 < sibiria> you can fingerprint the EFI/BIOS and your bootloader
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17:56 < sibiria> it's not ideal compared to a proper Secure Boot setup but it gets you somewhere
17:57 < broke> I wouldn't trust any of that and just override another install on top.
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18:00 < ivdsangen> broke: what if they placed a hardware keylogger in the laptop and your fresh install's passwords are sent to the attacker
18:01 < broke> well I would first flash the latest bios from a burner windows SSD.
18:02 < broke> or through hardware based bios overrides
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18:03 < sibiria> i'd feel safe enough with Secure Boot after having enrolled my own keys
18:03 < broke> I feel like that still doesn't save you from what ivdsangen mentioned, that is, hardware keyloggers.
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18:04 < broke> Getting rid of this is sophisticated, I don't have experience so I do not know if I will be able to flash another bios from a burner windows install, but I can certainly just override the bios using a flash clip and flashrom.
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18:09 < oldlaptop> "the attacker technically had physical access in a public place for a minute while my back was turned" is a rather different threat model than "the police eventually did get my laptop back after a month or three"
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18:48 < deimosBSD> I'm on i5-8250U with a vintage Protectli 480GB nvme with ffs encryption and don't notice much of a difference
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19:37 < broke> deimosBSD: how much of speed lost due to encryption? in terms of pure r/w speed?
19:37 < broke> s/lost/reduced/
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20:18 < deimosBSD> i didn't measure it
20:18 < deimosBSD> but i don't notice it's much different
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22:33 < echelon> hi
22:34 < echelon> does unbound automatically use your upstream dns server, retrieved from dhcpleased?
22:39 < sibiria> no. it doesn't know what dhcpleased or dhcp is. by default it's an iterator, meaning it does all the dns resolution itself
22:40 < echelon> ai is saying resolvd will create a forward.conf in /var/unbound/etc/ as long as you do an include against in unbound.conf
22:43 < sibiria> sounds like it hallucinated something that systemd-resolvd may or may not do on some specific linux dist
22:44 < echelon> i told it to check the documentation, it corrected itself and is now saying this is the behavior between resolvd + unwind
22:45 < sibiria> that's correct, resolvd will check if unwind is enabled/running
22:46 < echelon> what was the decision for doing it for unwind but not for unbound
22:46 < sibiria> they are two very different pieces of software
22:47 < sibiria> unwind is just a forwarder for the local host. unbound is a caching iterator (and forwarder etc.) for the entire network, or the Internet if you feel like it
22:49 < echelon> ok, it sounds like i should be using unwind then
22:49 < sibiria> if you just want to do DoT or DoH on that one specific machine, yeah, unwind is the best choice for that
22:49 < echelon> well, i do have specific zones i need forwarding rules for
22:50 < echelon> can they run side by side?
22:51 < sibiria> yeah but then you'll have to tell unbound to listen on something else than port 53 on the loopback interface. unwind is hard-coded to listen there
22:52 < sibiria> if you need different rules for different zones, it's easier to only use unbound
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22:54 < echelon> but unbound doesn't have DoH/DoT?
22:54 < sibiria> it does
22:54 < echelon> oh ok
22:54 < echelon> yeah, i'll just go with unbound and configure upstream dns by hand then
22:56 < echelon> at which point i can probably disable resolvd?
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22:56 < echelon> or does it interact with unbound somehow
22:56 < sibiria> it does not
22:57 < sibiria> resolvd only "manages" /etc/resolv.conf for you
22:57 < sibiria> or fuck it up for you, if you forget to disable it and want to handle resolv.conf yourself
22:57 -!- Wateir_ is now known as Wateir
22:58 < sibiria> it learns about name servers from various sources and tries to be helpful by automatically adding to and rewrite resolv.conf
22:58 < sibiria> if you want to run unbound, disable resolvd and point resolv.conf to unbound manually
22:58 < echelon> actually, if i leave /etc/resolv.conf managed by resolvd it should interfere with the functionality of unbound
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22:59 < echelon> if the purpose for unbound is to just do forwarding for clients over dhpd
22:59 < echelon> dhcpd*
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23:06 < echelon> shouldn't*
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--- Log closed Wed Aug 19 00:00:28 2026